Russia Vs. America; Here we go again kids!

[Asininedrivel]

As we speak everyday people in the Ukraine are facing off against armoured divisions with fucking rifles and molotov cocktails.

Yeah, it's got a pretty nasty Volkssturm vibe to it. Hopefully it's much less barbaric.

Although if it is successful then how long until Russia turns Ukrainian cities into another Aleppo / Grozny / Afghanistan (etc)?

 

[Flow-Rider]

I think there was a bit of over sensationalism in that article myself, just because the unit is valued at 8mil today it doesn't mean that's what they've paid for it years ago.

I couldn't think of a worse place to live if I was a billionaire, get locked up for just a slip of tongue, can't show any affection to your partner in public, under paid migrants workers, they only just allowed people to live in the same apartment with a friend of the opposite gender. A lot of other gender issues too. @PINT of Stella. mate! You would be jailed the first day, you can't be found drunk and disorderly in public.

 

[Sky_Collapsed]

why would NATO endanger the rest of Europe and other NATO members by going into a non NATO member country to fight a war rather than bolster other NATO members against encroachment? You realise Putins excuse for going full retard is if NATO takes part in what is going on, right?

they are litterally protecting the EU by not fighting.

What they're doing now is essentially watching people die. Sanctions won't do jackshit and by just sitting back they are just allowing the situation further down the road to be harder than it really needs to be.

When Russia gets Ukraine it's an easy base of operations for attacks on Poland and etc.

 

[Squidfayce]

It’s not about the properties. It’s about the allure of power.

It’s funny that in spite of all your knowledge in finance you’re still thinking like a millionaire where a fancy house on a nice beach would probably satisfy you. They’re billionaires and ones with an obsession with old money, celebrity and ostentatious displays of wealth*.

The Arab Sheiks are the same, despite creating high tech luxury oasis’s in the middle of the desert why do you think they all invest so much money in European property and spend so much time over there, gallivanting around with royalty, sports stars, supermodels, actors and other celebrities?

You threaten access to that world, couple it with an increasingly hostile population at home and you stand a good chance of getting a few to turn on their boss.

*US billionaires seem to be more concerned with sending themselves into orbit but it boils down to the same thing: Bragging rights.

The allure of power is a separate topic all together. The discussion has been about their assets.

It's doubtful their access to ANYTHING is materially compromised. You seem to think that assets don't play a part in this. If your wealth is immaterial impacted, you continue to hold as much influence and power. You get that money makes all this go round right? Everything and everyone has a price, believe it or not.

Just watch. These people will not bat an eyelid at what is going on to "stop" them. You may even see a few laughs and back slaps. Their world will not crumble.

 

[Squidfayce]

What's more I really fail to understand how using what limited avenues we have for attacking those in Putin's inner circle, is somehow a bad idea because it's in the 'too hard' basket and has a debatable probability of success.

As we speak everyday people in the Ukraine are facing off against armoured divisions with fucking rifles and molotov cocktails. They're not shying away from the fight because it's too difficult and almost certainly doomed to fail in the short term. The very least we can do is start revoking visas, engaging the torturous wheels of the legal system and generally making life difficult for those who have the most influence in this whole tragedy.

It's not that we shouldn't do these things. Do it. Do it hard and fast and make lots of fanfare about it. People just need to understand that this is all just theatre and doing these things is unlikely to influence anything. I'm firmly on the "meh" side of the fence about this show.

I'm more keen to see putin torn down by his people. Russia is not a stranger to revolutions.

 

[Squidfayce]

What they're doing now is essentially watching people die. Sanctions won't do jackshit and by just sitting back they are just allowing the situation further down the road to be harder than it really needs to be.

When Russia gets Ukraine it's an easy base of operations for attacks on Poland and etc.

We don't know what the future holds in that regard. But one thing is certain if NATO steps across the border and that is an actual full scale European, if not world war.

So sitting back and "watching people die" is the better alternative than watching an entire continent burn.

It's the least shit of the two options.

 

[Asininedrivel]

What they're doing now is essentially watching people die. Sanctions won't do jackshit and by just sitting back they are just allowing the situation further down the road to be harder than it really needs to be.

When Russia gets Ukraine it's an easy base of operations for attacks on Poland and etc.

So what's the alternative then? Intervene? If we do - if any of us do - Putin will use that an excuse to extrapolate far beyond what's currently occurring. He's already tacitly threatened a nuclear strike on anyone who dares do so.

Bottom line - you want to see a major population centre in Australia go up in a mushroom cloud cus we sent some F/A-18s to bomb some Russian APCs approaching Kiev?

 

[PINT of Stella. mate!]

You get that money makes all this go round right? Everything and everyone has a price, believe it or not.

Novak Djokovic has a net worth of US$220m.
How did that work out for him when it came to playing in Australia this year?

Jeffrey Epstein was worth US$580m when he died. It didn’t keep him out of a jail cell.

Pablo Escobar and Joaquin El Chapo Guzman were both estimated to be worth billions but that didn’t stop the authorities putting a stop to them when there was enough will.

On the flip side, there is a long history of criminal enterprises being undone because those close to the top have flipped out of their own self-interest. Putin’s government is at its heart just a giant criminal enterprise.

 

[Sky_Collapsed]

So what's the alternative then? Intervene? If we do - if any of us do - Putin will use that an excuse to extrapolate far beyond what's currently occurring. He's already tacitly threatened a nuclear strike on anyone who dares do so.

Bottom line - you want to see a major population centre in Australia go up in a mushroom cloud cus we sent some F/A-18s to bomb some Russian APCs approaching Kiev?

what's with people fetishing nuclear war?

I think you're running with the hyperbolic mainstream narrative here, putin did threaten grave consequences but he hasn't specifically threatened the use of nuclear weapons.

In any case, even if he did nuclear war is a lose lose for both sides, Russia uses one and immediately has 400 nuclear weapons pointed at him from just Western Europe alone and that's not including the 1800 deployed that the U.S has with a total of 6800.

 

[Squidfayce]

what's with people fetishing nuclear war?

I think you're running with the hyperbolic mainstream narrative here, putin did threaten grave consequences but he hasn't specifically threatened the use of nuclear weapons.

In any case, even if he did nuclear war is a lose lose for both sides, Russia uses one and immediately has 400 nuclear weapons pointed at him from just Western Europe alone and that's not including the 1800 deployed that the U.S has with a total of 6800.

The language was well understood to mean a nuclear threat. This is how the game is played.
It's a deterent, you say these things to deter people.

 

[Squidfayce]

Novak Djokovic has a net worth of US$220m.
How did that work out for him when it came to playing in Australia this year?

Jeffrey Epstein was worth US$580m when he died. It didn’t keep him out of a jail cell.

Pablo Escobar and Joaquin El Chapo Guzman were both estimated to be worth billions but that didn’t stop the authorities putting a stop to them when there was enough will.

On the flip side, there is a long history of criminal enterprises being undone because those close to the top have flipped out of their own self-interest. Putin’s government is at its heart just a giant criminal enterprise.

All of these are false equivalencies and not even on the same level.

We can cross our fingers though. That's about the best you can do.

 

[Asininedrivel]

what's with people fetishing nuclear war?

What part of "consequences they have never seen" is ambiguous?

 

[Litenbror]

Money is a very difficult thing to conceptualise so putting it into a frame of time works very well.

1 million seconds is about 12 days
1 billion seconds is about 31.7 years

 

[Sky_Collapsed]

The language was well understood to mean a nuclear threat. This is how the game is played.
It's a deterent, you say these things to deter people.

going from threat to using it are two different things entirely. The instant he does he has around about 500 nuclear weapons pointed at him from just western europe alone.

Putin is more calculated than that and knows using nuclear weapons is a lose lose.

 

[johnny]

Unsure how true this is:

 

[Squidfayce]

going from threat to using it are two different things entirely. The instant he does he has around about 500 nuclear weapons pointed at him from just western europe alone.

Putin is more calculated than that and knows using nuclear weapons is a lose lose.

No one wants a nuclear war, but it won't stop unclear armed powers using the threats. The threats are effective because no one is willing to test the "is he crazy enough?" Theory.

There is some discussion in various academic circles about these "leader for life" types becoming more unstable/unpredictable as their mental faculties diminish with age.

 

[johnny]

No idea if this is true either, but it would be a hell of a war crime if the strike was successful.

 

[Sky_Collapsed]

No one wants a nuclear war, but it won't stop unclear armed powers using the threats. The threats are effective because no one is willing to test the "is he crazy enough?" Theory.

We've all seen the destruction that nuclear weapons cause and it's simply just not going to be a realistic scenario, especially not in the digital era when you can do more calculated damage by electronic warfare.

Even if nuclear weapons were to be used they'd likely be used to produce an EMP to knock out communications and etc. It's not worth the wasted money using a nuclear weapon to bomb a city when traditional explosives are cheaper and get the same job done.

There is some discussion in various academic circles about these "leader for life" types becoming more unstable/unpredictable as their mental faculties diminish with age.

bruh this discussion is very wide, it's not just "Some academic circles" We all talk about this.

 

[Squidfayce]

We've all seen the destruction that nuclear weapons cause and it's simply just not going to be a realistic scenario, especially not in the digital era when you can do more calculated damage by electronic warfare.

Even if nuclear weapons were to be used they'd likely be used to produce an EMP to knock out communications and etc. It's not worth the wasted money using a nuclear weapon to bomb a city when traditional explosives are cheaper and get the same job done.



bruh this discussion is very wide, it's not just "Some academic circles" We all talk about this.

I think it's naive to assume there is no risk of nuclear war. If the risk wasn't real, people wouldn't be afraid to step in.

I dont think is outside the realm of possibility some cunt just goes "a fuck it" and does it. It's almost happened several times in our history.

 

[Scotty T]

Mate on socials shared a pic of a hand drawn roadie "drop bars not bombs" so I made my own. Post up your drop something not bombs pics. It's been an interesting if information overloading read here. I'm a few beers in with a knee that pretty much dislocated yesterday so just lightening up the mood with a positive message.