Ivanhoe Council Jumps

[mtbdh_girl]

I just wanted to express my dissappointment at whomever the people are who have destroyed the council jumps. I realise they were not great (or big!) to begin with, however there was some variety. There used to be 3 lines -2 lines of small/medium doubles, and one decent line of tabletops. I went down on Sunday and was very dissappointed to find someone has dug out the tabletops turning them all into doubles. (and they've left the place in a mess with incomplete work)

Why?

Not everyone rides doubles. Starting on the tabletops is a good way to build up to something with a gap, no matter how small. The more riders learning to jump/ using the jumps, the more likely the council will notice and work to provide more/better facilities. Strength in numbers counts, and previously Ivanhoe was ridable by anyone. Ok, these jumps were not big, but that was part of the appeal to the general public, and that is what the council is there to do - work for the general community. If a minority continually ruin what are legal jumps, eventually the council will remove them, as the space will be better utilised to serve a majority of the community.

 

[S!C!E!R!]

yeah and also there needs to be some sort of education because their are are all these XC riders and little kids riding over them and destroying them!

 

[alexanderwilkinson-beards]

i argree srcew those pepole

 

[Dozer]

So they haven't changed the up and down ramps, just dug the middle of the table out to make it a double yeah? Why would you waste your time? It isn't going to prove anything!
Does the council do anything to maintain the area? They sound like they don't mind the jumps being there, that is great! Pity some people are spoiling it.

 

[mtbdh_girl]

So they haven't changed the up and down ramps, just dug the middle of the table out to make it a double yeah? Why would you waste your time? It isn't going to prove anything!
Does the council do anything to maintain the area? They sound like they don't mind the jumps being there, that is great! Pity some people are spoiling it.

They are council jumps. Very occasionally the council does minimal maintenance of them, and also keep the area mown. The ramps have in some cases been built up a little, and not done properly (ie hit it and it will crumble). One ramp has a log across it near the bottom, and has been dug out to accomodate the log, however no work has been done to build earth up under the log or above it.

yeah and also there needs to be some sort of education because their are are all these XC riders and little kids riding over them and destroying them!

This is just an uninformed response. A xc or child rider who rolls gently over a table top will cause no damage. FYI: I do not define my riding style as anything in particular. I do a bit of every thing. In the past I have raced elite dh & 4x, and do a little bit of jumping and skatepark/street. I also go on many xc rides. My 6yo daughter races bmx, rides xc as well as I do and loved riding over those jumps. She is not yet able to gap jumps, though given a couple of years on those table tops she would have!

It is comments like yours which encourage lack of support for disciplines of riding such as DJ. The more those jumps are used by people like me and my family, ie. the general public, the more notice the council will take, and the more maintenence and facilities there will be. If only a small % of people can use a facility, then there is no incentive for the council to take an interest. The more people who get involved, the better for the sport. To get people involved, you need beginner jumps, as well as gaps. Commonsense. We all have to start somewhere.

 

[On ya bike]

I'm a local around that area, I'm riding them almost everyday. AND YES. kids/XC rolling over the doubles has turned them into a set of rollars. Im not sure who dug the holes in the tabos but bad luck, if kids want to jump they should build their own trails...

But then again i do agree. people shouldn't f*ck them up because i remember when i used to jump them. But then again i did attempt to build my own little jumps.

 

[pavey]

Ah I was down there a couple on months ago and someone had half ass-edly tryed to dig out the first table (or maybe it was just crumble). I don't know anyone who gets into DJ by starting on doubles, infact mostly to start off it is rolling over. Pitty these d**ks had to go and do that.
Perhaps contact the council and try and get them to co-operate with you to get a big maintenance day (like with a free bbq to get more people) where things like this can be fixed up, and you could maybe get a new line running (like straight down the middle before the biggest one)... Just something to think about.

 

[inlina]

yeah and also there needs to be some sort of education because their are are all these XC riders and little kids riding over them and destroying them!

i argree srcew those pepole

I'm a local around that area, I'm riding them almost everyday. AND YES. kids/XC rolling over the doubles has turned them into a set of rollars. Im not sure who dug the holes in the tabos but bad luck, if kids want to jump they should build their own trails...

You idiots. That line was a beginner's line. It was put there by the council and left for riders to maintain, not destroy. It is there as an entry level. If you don't like the quality of the jumps on that line, there are two other lines there that are doubles. Why changes the beginner's line?

"if kids want to jump they should build their own trails..." => How about if you want small doubles, you go build them elsewhere. These are council jumps, they should by right have a small table-top line.

Have any of you ney-sayers (to kids and XC riders rolling tables) ever been to a BMX track. The lips on the tables are rollable and not dirt-jump kicky. You can either roll them or clear them. Why should the beginner's lines at these jumps be any different?

When I was their on the weekend, a couple of kids rolled up (around 10-11 y.o.), one wearing his fullface ready to do the small line. There was dissapointment on their faces when they saw the beginner's line. They left. This is NOT GOOD for the sport as a whole. What gives anyone else the right to say these kids shouldn't have the opportunity to learn how to jump on council jumps?

CG

 

[jacobmy20]

council

i recently have had the council ruin some of the jumps in our local area..

i think they should ask somebody before they decide that they r the know it all of dirt jumps!

 

[pavey]

i recently have had the council ruin some of the jumps in our local area..

i think they should ask somebody before they decide that they r the know it all of dirt jumps!

They had the right to if it was on council owned land. This is about regular people destroying/modifying council jumps, not council destroying regular peoples jumps.

 

[Duff_Man]

I think this is not only a problem at the council jumps but also a general problem in that area. I think there is a group of younger kids, who i think use this forum, who are really doing some damage to the area.....These kids, you know who you are if you are reading this, run around in there little "gang" of merry gay men and tag signs, trash the council jumps, trash other people's jumps and pritty much just make a mess of the area...what you dont understand is that by doing what you are doing you are not only making it worse for yourselfs...but you are making it worse for everyone else...lets face it you are all pritty tough...i mean i sure wouldnt wana cross you big tough little 15 yr old in an alley way....Ill BURRY YOU IN A FUKIN WHOLE at ivanhoe and no one besides your mummy will be wondering where you are...If you dont thinkso, and you are one of these kids PM me and we will see how you go. First of all, you must understand that what you are doing is a waste of time, and second of all it is destroying what has taken many years of hard work to build...of which you had no involvement. Me and Mark did a big walk of all the jump sites in the area after we got a visit from parks one afternoon while we were digging our trails...ours were the last set of trails they visited and once they got to us they were pritty pissed off....we didnt know why, but after taking a little work around the place we could understand why...there is about 6 different sites atm, they are trashed and look like shit...rubbish everywhere on the ground, tress cut off 1m from the ground, tags on trees and just a general mess.....the idea is to make as little impact as possible and try and keep the area in as best condition possible....if you are not going to play nice then the council will just keep on doing what they do, and at the end of the day we will end up with nothing.

P.S. There is no division in riding...i mean sure there is a slight bit a back talk between one another but at the end of the day it is riding bikes...you kids who dj who think your rather kool and what not...you know tough..i ride street look at me etc...i could introduce you to many ppl you ride xc who would probs walk all over you in a park or set of trails...so shut the fuk up and ride your bike!!!!

 

[Rickystp0]

I think this is not only a problem at the council jumps but also a general problem in that area. I think there is a group of younger kids, who i think use this forum, who are really doing some damage to the area.....These kids, you know who you are if you are reading this, run around in there little "gang" of merry gay men and tag signs, trash the council jumps, trash other people's jumps and pritty much just make a mess of the area...what you dont understand is that by doing what you are doing you are not only making it worse for yourselfs...but you are making it worse for everyone else...lets face it you are all pritty tough...i mean i sure wouldnt wana cross you big tough little 15 yr old in an alley way....Ill BURRY YOU IN A FUKIN WHOLE at ivanhoe and no one besides your mummy will be wondering where you are...If you dont thinkso, and you are one of these kids PM me and we will see how you go. First of all, you must understand that what you are doing is a waste of time, and second of all it is destroying what has taken many years of hard work to build...of which you had no involvement. Me and Mark did a big walk of all the jump sites in the area after we got a visit from parks one afternoon while we were digging our trails...ours were the last set of trails they visited and once they got to us they were pritty pissed off....we didnt know why, but after taking a little work around the place we could understand why...there is about 6 different sites atm, they are trashed and look like shit...rubbish everywhere on the ground, tress cut off 1m from the ground, tags on trees and just a general mess.....the idea is to make as little impact as possible and try and keep the area in as best condition possible....if you are not going to play nice then the council will just keep on doing what they do, and at the end of the day we will end up with nothing.

P.S. There is no division in riding...i mean sure there is a slight bit a back talk between one another but at the end of the day it is riding bikes...you kids who dj who think your rather kool and what not...you know tough..i ride street look at me etc...i could introduce you to many ppl you ride xc who would probs walk all over you in a park or set of trails...so shut the fuk up and ride your bike!!!!

I know exactly who you are talking about and have met a few of them in ivanhoe and at the skatepark. They stole our jumps as well then started digging there when they were like 3/4 done and F**Ked them up totally.
I hate them.

 

[betelnut]

I'm a local around that area, I'm riding them almost everyday. AND YES. kids/XC rolling over the doubles has turned them into a set of rollars. Im not sure who dug the holes in the tabos but bad luck, if kids want to jump they should build their own trails...

The whole idea of that particular line was to learn how to jump, you fool. Your suggestion of kids building their own trails to learn on just shows how ignorant you are.

I occasionally go there to practice jumping and that line was pretty freakin' helpful. Please feel free to come and tell me how I should build my own trails next time you see me there, so I can give you some helpful feedback via a kick in the bollocks.

 

[sossy]

I'm a local around that area, I'm riding them almost everyday...snip... if kids want to jump they should build their own trails...

hmmm, spot the irony.

I'm glad this little topic came up, as it's one that I am quite passionate about.

Okay, so the council built some jumps, they may not be the greatest, they may not be for everyone, but they did their bit and providided a sport and rec service to the public. Now far be it from me to make some observations and draw some conclusions, but fark me if this whoel thing doesnt stink of hipocracy.

How many times do we see whinging on here about councils destroying jumps, about bulldozers and all that goes with it??? Too much would be my observation. Then people whinge and say council should build jumps if they dont want them built whereever.

Here we have a council that has been proactive about things, actually built jumps for the public, and provided a place for people to ride, learn to ride and generally do so in a safe manner,t hat is accessable for emergency services should they be needed.

For its effort, what has the council recieved? nothing but a big pile of the proverbial kicked back in their face.

If you take a ride along the XC tracks that are the "yarra trails", it is clearly evident that people arent thankful for what the council has done. As has been mentioned, rubbish left everywhere, the place at times looks like anythign but the parklands it is.

Riding the XC trails I know I personally, and many others I speak to and ride with have come damn close to doing ourselves some mischief when rolling along trails and come around a corner to find some new half built, half arsed dirt jumps being built on the main xc trail.

These are trails that are ridden often by people of varying ability, and at various times of the day. I know the FTF club runs a weeknight ride through the area, that ride includes current solo 24 champ Andrew Bell, as well as any number of other elite xc riders out training.

Building these "jumps" on the trail is downright thoughtless and otright dangerous. While the are may loko great with a nice run in and run out area, there is a reason for that, they are xc trails, riding with wheels on the ground is what is done. Coming around a corner to find these "jumps"is one day going to cause someone to come to grief, and it may not be in a small way. I dont think I would like to be the one responsible for building something illegal in a spot used by others that ended up injuring others that werent using them... Imagine the guilt of being responsible for a riders mishap that cost them the chance to represent there country at worlds?

The building of the illegal jumps does nothing to help the sport whatsoever in the councils eyes. Many other councils look at the Ivanhoe jumps to assess the viability and worthfullness of the concept. If I still worked at council, I wouldnt be in a hurry to recommend my council do the same, as it has done nothign to eradicte the problem, infact, has probably made the problem worse with more riders int he area wanting to build "their" jumps.

The xc trails along the area took a lot of work to be approved, a lot of work to be built and a lot of work to be maintained... why does this happen? because riders are involved, liaise with council and assist council in the maintenance, the planning and the building.

Have any of the "jumpers" considered contacting council via the right channels to offer the same assistance for the jump area? Local governemnt is that, local government, they arent dirt jumpers, they arent xc riders, they make decisions about council issues, then respond as a council. They may welcome the input and advice and assistance of some people "in the know". You wont get paid, you may have to give up some of your time, but bugger me, you think the xc trails are paid for?

When I say right channels, I dont mean "OMG, LYK BUILD TEH JUMPS THIS WAY TEHY WUD BE DA BESTZZOR" or however all that crap goes. Approach the council like repsonsible young adults and speak to the relevant people.

Basically, those that dug out the table tops, those that build illegal jumps in an area where there are legal jumps, those that build on existing xc tracks.... THINK, THINK AGAIN, THEN ACT!

Sometimes your actions have far wider reaching ramifications than you may think.

This rant was brought to you buy the number 7 and the letter L.

 

[digtrails]

Although the council have made efforts to accommodate some dirt jumpers by providing this facility there is still the underlying fact that there are a lot of riders that have a skill level way above that of what is required to ride those council jumps.

Fair enough that the jumps that are there be left there for beginners, but apart from that they don't really accommodate for riders with more experience.

The best condition those jumps were ever in was about 5 years ago when they first got built. Since then efforts have been made to fix them maybe once or twice, and now they have just become dilapidated.
In addition to this the dirt is just shitty land fill, ridden with rocks and glass. If you come off your bike there you are likely to walk away with a number of cuts and grazes, something that wouldn't happen if you crashed on clean fill.

Banyule council also put limitations on what could be built. Jumps could only be built up to a certain size, no holes were to be dug, etc. This may not seem like much of a problem to the majority of the riders who use the facility as they are mostly beginners. But, the reason the facility was provided in the first place was to replace Ivanhoe 1 (next to the boardwalk section of the bike track). By replacing what had been hundreds of hours of work there with some shitty dirt in the open was like putting the diggers back on training wheels again. This is why they have kept on digging in the trees.

The problem you have with kids building dirt mounds on the xc tracks i cant answer for but it is most likely to be the type of kids Duff_Man is referring to.
The group of builders in ivanhoe that have been digging amongst the trees for years have never built on an existing xc track. What usually happens is they make a track into the trails which then sort of ends up as a single track because people ride in and out so much!

 

[On ya bike]

The whole idea of that particular line was to learn how to jump, you fool. Your suggestion of kids building their own trails to learn on just shows how ignorant you are.

I occasionally go there to practice jumping and that line was pretty freakin' helpful. Please feel free to come and tell me how I should build my own trails next time you see me there, so I can give you some helpful feedback via a kick in the bollocks.

Ok, so you occasionally go there... tell me, if your a beginner would you like to fall over at Eaglemont? answer that..
NO!
The ground there is shit hard, filled with huge spikey rocks. point of this > Beginners fall over > head into rock, yes i have seen it a lot. and if your going to say '' what about the people who want to jump just once, just to have fun?'' THEY SHOULDN'T, THERE IS A LOT OF RISK INVOLVED!

If you want to learn to jump, building your own trails is A LOT better, you can add to them whenever you progress and its a great atmosphere.

 

[mtbdh_girl]

If you want to learn to jump, building your own trails is A LOT better, you can add to them whenever you progress and its a great atmosphere.

So can you explain where a beginner gets the expertise and knowledge to build their own safe properly spaced jumps? Or the motivation to build something he does'nt yet know if he'll like, and isn't sure he can do for that matter?

Where is this beginner supposed to build jumps? Starting off the wrong way by copying the illegal ones? The atmosphere comes from a group, and since illegal jumps are hidden how is anyone supposed to find him/his jumps to form a group? I understand the issue with safety, glass, rocks etc, but council sees the same problem out on the trails - loads of rubbish etc.

I agree that part of the problem is a lack of facilities from council, but as far as they know you don't use the ones provided, so why provide more? It is the same as what happened w/ skate ramps back in the 80's. There was a surge in use and the council provided facilities to accomodate this. Then skill level got to the point where only the biggest of the ramps were being used, the smaller ones fell in to disrepair because there was no point in the councils maintaining things that weren't being used, and as a result there are very few decent half pipes left.

The same thing is happening to DJ. The beginner stuff is being ruined by kids who are bored with it, the really good riders build illegally so don't use them, and there is no reason for the council to maintain them or build bigger ones. There is little new blood coming in since there are no beginner facilities, and the growth of the sport is stunted. The new blood that does move in to the sport isn't noticed by council since rather than use the legal jumps they have moved in via illegal channels , and so council doesn't recognise even the stunted growth of what could be a very strong discipline.

 

[Sic]

If you want to learn to jump, building your own trails is A LOT better, you can add to them whenever you progress and its a great atmosphere.

Right so kids who want to get started should put in countless hours of work to see if they really like dirt jumping?

Council jumps are a certain height and type to keep in line with liability issues and the fact they have to cater to a mixed skill level including beginners.

Oh and pretty much what mtbdh_girl said.

 

[betelnut]

Ok, so you occasionally go there... tell me, if your a beginner would you like to fall over at Eaglemont? answer that..
NO!
The ground there is shit hard, filled with huge spikey rocks. point of this > Beginners fall over > head into rock, yes i have seen it a lot. and if your going to say '' what about the people who want to jump just once, just to have fun?'' THEY SHOULDN'T, THERE IS A LOT OF RISK INVOLVED!

If you want to learn to jump, building your own trails is A LOT better, you can add to them whenever you progress and its a great atmosphere.

Right, so the answer is to build your own jumps, which again proves your ignorance. That particular line at the Ivanhoe jumps was built for people to learn on. Yes, it may be crappy and there may be rocks in the soil, but it is COUNCIL APPROVED. Trashing them by digging them out isn't helpful to anyone, and gives ALL bike riders a bad image.

ALL ground is hard when you hit it. Building elsewhere won't fix that, unless it's a freakin' foam pit. All people learning to jump will fall over and many will hurt themselves. Minimising that damage is what the beginner's line was for. Making tables into doubles makes the chances of injury higher, which is not what the council wants.

Give up. Your original post proved that you had nothing worthwhile to say, and now you're simply reinforcing that fact.

 

[On ya bike]

1) Look I'm not the one who ruined the tables.
2) My friend who is 8 who has never jumped in his life, Jumped those doubles.
3) I wouldn't even learn at Ivanhoe jumps OR suggest anyone else too.