Chicken Run, Mt Riv Closed ?!?
- Thread starter Kramer
- Start date
bikesarefun
Likes Bikes and Dirt
I'm sure someone will post photos of the heavy machinery shortly. It's disgraceful.
Moggio
Likes Bikes and Dirt
Spoke to Blue Mountains Council and they said it is Crown Land doing this.
They surmise it may have been complaints from Mt Riverview residents and Crown lands have gone in. Hence I guess the approach they are taking which is pretty brutal chopping trees and the like. If council were doing this it would be more of a bush regeneration approach.
I have called Crown Lands to find out why this is happening?
Here are some pics I have been forwarded, thanks to the original photographer.
View attachment 315116
They surmise it may have been complaints from Mt Riverview residents and Crown lands have gone in. Hence I guess the approach they are taking which is pretty brutal chopping trees and the like. If council were doing this it would be more of a bush regeneration approach.
I have called Crown Lands to find out why this is happening?
Here are some pics I have been forwarded, thanks to the original photographer.
View attachment 315116
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GeurieMTB
Likes Dirt
Who is the land manager? Crown Lands are rarely not in trust or managed by a council for instance. Its very unusual for Crown to be the direct land manager, even more unusual for them to spend money on their reserves
Maybe this patch still has its own trust?
Moggio
Likes Bikes and Dirt
Haven't got that information yet from Crown Lands. All I know is that Council said they don't have any control over this section of Crown Lands. There is another quite well known bike feature in the lower mountains that council have never acted on because it is in the open because it is on crown land despite being surrounded by council land.
On the flip side that is probably what has kept Chicken Run off the radar and open after the debarcle of the closure of Old Bathurst Road and Mt Riverview trails five years ago.
So what triggered this is a mystery I hope to find out. The person I spoke to suggested fire mitigation, but seemingly more as a guess than based on information. That also seems unlikely.
On the flip side that is probably what has kept Chicken Run off the radar and open after the debarcle of the closure of Old Bathurst Road and Mt Riverview trails five years ago.
So what triggered this is a mystery I hope to find out. The person I spoke to suggested fire mitigation, but seemingly more as a guess than based on information. That also seems unlikely.
hazza6542
Eats Squid
Yeah some of those photo's are mine, 'we only chopped down dead trees', yeah right pal. Plenty of healthy, fine trees there that have been cut down, and the fire road completely blocked off! Sad day yesterday. I'll chuck up a photo of all the information we've received. So far on facebook (Blue Mountains City Council page, comment on their cover photo) there's been a lot of support, and council is claiming they had no idea about it. Might not be their area to deal with but surely they would have been given warning? Just a shame we didn't, I turned down doing a full run the day before it got destroyed.
More info coming, questions will be asked at the Knapsack DH build day this weekend. Cheers for making calls Moggy, I'll charge my phone and get the photo of the signs posted. Stan Rees is the guy to contact. Good feeling he's the bloke I almost hit riding down the trail a few days before these signs got posted.
More info coming, questions will be asked at the Knapsack DH build day this weekend. Cheers for making calls Moggy, I'll charge my phone and get the photo of the signs posted. Stan Rees is the guy to contact. Good feeling he's the bloke I almost hit riding down the trail a few days before these signs got posted.
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Moggio
Likes Bikes and Dirt
Crown Lands returned my call and openly answered my questions.
Firstly the trigger for this was complaints from local residents. I asked whether these were reported by council and his reply was to paraphrase in incredulity "why would council do that, its not their land to manage. No, it was local residents to us". Complaints were primarily about damage to the area, trees being chopped down etc
Further a claim on the land has also recently been granted by the Land Council, so maybe this actually made them act upon the complaints?
He also warned that builders should not build there anymore in case they are caught because Crown Lands would want to prosecute. Obviously I don't know how real this threat is.
Sadly the result is a terrible outcome which is likely to have ramifications elsewhere.
I should add that BMORC and BMCC have worked hard to establish good working communications which would be detrimental if they were eroded. BMCC have shown that they actively consult with key contacts before acting on complaints and determining their response. I can assure you this has resulted in a very different result for the BM trails than if this relationship didn't exist and this goes way beyond Knapsack.
Firstly the trigger for this was complaints from local residents. I asked whether these were reported by council and his reply was to paraphrase in incredulity "why would council do that, its not their land to manage. No, it was local residents to us". Complaints were primarily about damage to the area, trees being chopped down etc
Further a claim on the land has also recently been granted by the Land Council, so maybe this actually made them act upon the complaints?
He also warned that builders should not build there anymore in case they are caught because Crown Lands would want to prosecute. Obviously I don't know how real this threat is.
Sadly the result is a terrible outcome which is likely to have ramifications elsewhere.
I should add that BMORC and BMCC have worked hard to establish good working communications which would be detrimental if they were eroded. BMCC have shown that they actively consult with key contacts before acting on complaints and determining their response. I can assure you this has resulted in a very different result for the BM trails than if this relationship didn't exist and this goes way beyond Knapsack.
thecat
NSWMTB, Central Tableland MBC
So to prevent trees being chopped down they bring in machinery and chop a heap of trees down?
Seems legit.
Trails were over 20 years old. 2 foot wide and well built. apparently this is much better
To do so with zero consultation is weak as piss and twice as yellow.
I've always considered myself a bit of a greeny, love being outdoors in nature. If this sort of thing leaves someone like me hating the "greenies" how do they think they hope to get the younger guys to appreciate environmental values?
Hi there lads,
as i said i had a extensive conversation with stan reese after possibly impersonating a dog walked who was ferious at the destruction of the fire trail but managed to drop in hints at their intention to the remaining trails at chicken run and from my knowledge in his response he knew nothing about the pain marking on the other trails and has no intention of damaging or destroying the existing trail.
In reference to the land claim aboriginal land council is most likely going to be given the land in the next year or hence stan resse level of care for the area being so low. i also believe the money they used to hire the excavator was given to them as a grant to clean up the area for the hand over so we could have a hole new ketlle of fish in a year or two. will be curious to see if this land grant includes the national park are at chicken which is pretty much from where it gets steep to the bottom. warning though to anyone else who may be building in the area this land grant will stretch up that gorge as far as blaxland around the tip to yellow rock and possibly to sun valley from my knowledge.
will let use know if i find anything else out plan on having a few conversation with council regarding an excavator rocking up in there back yard and wreaking havoc
as i said i had a extensive conversation with stan reese after possibly impersonating a dog walked who was ferious at the destruction of the fire trail but managed to drop in hints at their intention to the remaining trails at chicken run and from my knowledge in his response he knew nothing about the pain marking on the other trails and has no intention of damaging or destroying the existing trail.
In reference to the land claim aboriginal land council is most likely going to be given the land in the next year or hence stan resse level of care for the area being so low. i also believe the money they used to hire the excavator was given to them as a grant to clean up the area for the hand over so we could have a hole new ketlle of fish in a year or two. will be curious to see if this land grant includes the national park are at chicken which is pretty much from where it gets steep to the bottom. warning though to anyone else who may be building in the area this land grant will stretch up that gorge as far as blaxland around the tip to yellow rock and possibly to sun valley from my knowledge.
will let use know if i find anything else out plan on having a few conversation with council regarding an excavator rocking up in there back yard and wreaking havoc
Moggio
Likes Bikes and Dirt
Thanks hazza... at least it doesn't say anything about not riding there.
hazza6542
Eats Squid
Tommy online forum, careful what ya say. Interesting about the land ownership transfer. Reckon that area you were hinting at would spread to the graveyard or basement?
The guy at the track from the Soil Conservation Society, I won't post what he said here because he seemed like a good guy and it was very 'between you and me' stuff with him. But, he did say only dead tree were taken down. Total bull, they were fine, we've got the photo proof too.
The guy at the track from the Soil Conservation Society, I won't post what he said here because he seemed like a good guy and it was very 'between you and me' stuff with him. But, he did say only dead tree were taken down. Total bull, they were fine, we've got the photo proof too.
foxpuppet
Eats Squid
I messaged the council through facebook and got this response (before knowing it wasn't them doing the work)
Good Afternoon Banjo
In response to your concerns and comments about the MTB trails and trackwork at the end of Grandview Pde Mt Riverview, please know that this land is Crown Land and happens to belong to and is managed by NSW Crown Lands.
Only yesterday, Council was advised of soil conservation works being undertaken, by riders and the NSW Soil Conservation Service. NSW Crown Lands have advised that these works are being completed in order to address unapproved MTB trails in the area.
Council is looking into this further today and Crown Lands have advised Council, by way of signage at the site, that all queries should be directed to their customer contact centre on 1300 886 235.
Thanks for letting us know about this issue and we encourage you to ask questions of Council by direct message first, so that the correct information can then be made available to the public on facebook.
We have also responded on these two facebook posts regarding the come questions and concerns:
https://www.facebook.com/bluemounta...41452.175066762601689/770515326390160/?type=1
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...2100214922&type=1&comment_tracking={"tn":"O"}
Good Afternoon Banjo
In response to your concerns and comments about the MTB trails and trackwork at the end of Grandview Pde Mt Riverview, please know that this land is Crown Land and happens to belong to and is managed by NSW Crown Lands.
Only yesterday, Council was advised of soil conservation works being undertaken, by riders and the NSW Soil Conservation Service. NSW Crown Lands have advised that these works are being completed in order to address unapproved MTB trails in the area.
Council is looking into this further today and Crown Lands have advised Council, by way of signage at the site, that all queries should be directed to their customer contact centre on 1300 886 235.
Thanks for letting us know about this issue and we encourage you to ask questions of Council by direct message first, so that the correct information can then be made available to the public on facebook.
We have also responded on these two facebook posts regarding the come questions and concerns:
https://www.facebook.com/bluemounta...41452.175066762601689/770515326390160/?type=1
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...2100214922&type=1&comment_tracking={"tn":"O"}
stirk
Burner
Holy feck, just seen this thread and photo's.
What is a soil conservation person doing overseeing this blatant destruction which will encourage soil erosion?!
I suspected new locals may have complained but new land owners, didn't figure that.
It looks as though some trees were felled only to block the trail.
Would the new land custodians care if people are riding, walking dogs there if there is nothing else they can do with the land anyway?
What is a soil conservation person doing overseeing this blatant destruction which will encourage soil erosion?!
I suspected new locals may have complained but new land owners, didn't figure that.
It looks as though some trees were felled only to block the trail.
Would the new land custodians care if people are riding, walking dogs there if there is nothing else they can do with the land anyway?
dcrofty
Eats Squid
To be pedantic, soil con arent overseeing this, they have been contracted to perform the work but Crown Lands are the land manager and responsible. Soil con in my experience leave jobs in good conditions when finished.
stirk
Burner
Not another pedant! :heh:
Looks like soil con are doing more soil damage in one day than mtb has in over a decade.
Crown Lands are not the green National Sparks and Wild Fires, nor are they commodity driven State Forests, they manage land and environment as an object with no real care to the land or community.
Crown Lands encompass National Parks, State Forest and local parks, schools, but have little care as they can outsource the emotion to the other departments.
God save the Queen and her fascist regime! (yes I know the Queen has little to do with this now but it is 'crown' land
moggio my only doubt regarding this statement is even we didnt know who owned that land know one did the chances of the complaintees at least not being told by council to take there complaints elsewhere as they did with us last night pass the buck.
just throwing it out there know one of my knowledge would of know the lodge complaints to crown land until after the signs were put and there would of had to of been complaints before then.
one way or another bmcc definitely new something was up maybe not specifics but something.
just food for thought