^^^ THIS!! So I popped into a small Sydney CBD bike for a coffee, while waiting for said coffee I spied a very nice hardtail 29er and I happened to be in the market for exactly that kind of bike. Pulled the bike out of the rack, picked it up, played with it, even did that 'looking around for someone to serve me' thing. Nada, not even a hello. It's not even like the staff were with customers, they were just chatting to each other. But I'm guessing they are probably doing pretty well if they couldn't be bothered enough to take my $8 or $9k. I haven't been into that shop since and I never will.
An Open Letter To Chain Reaction Cycles
- Thread starter heavyp
- Start date
static_X3
Likes Dirt
The first thing LBS need to do is suck up the extra $5 an hour and hire competant staff, especially mechanics.
It's the hardcore guys that are going to spend hardcore dollars, and most of us know our shit so when we ask for a product and the sales-kid doesnt understand what you are asking and reccommends something that isnt even close to what you want/need it's kind of hard to have any faith in that store right from the get-go.
It's the hardcore guys that are going to spend hardcore dollars, and most of us know our shit so when we ask for a product and the sales-kid doesnt understand what you are asking and reccommends something that isnt even close to what you want/need it's kind of hard to have any faith in that store right from the get-go.
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You're absolutely right with all of those points. And I think we will definitely see a move toward people doing more of this as they get more comfortable with shopping online.
But I still think the LBS has an advantage in these situations that can be taken advantage of. That's why I think it's important for an LBS to see it as a competitive advantage and work hard to make sure it really is one.
I'm certainly not saying all bike shops do all the things in the list above, I'm just saying that bike shops should recognise that if they work hard to make customers happy by looking at what they can provide them (and then following through with it) the things on the list can be seen as advantageous to customers.
Certainly in the last three years working at my LBS I have found that those are the five things that walk in customers expect....and they are the things that make customers buy bikes and parts from us rather than go online (If we do it right!)
Also Re. bike fit. I think for a lot of guys on RB they are very experienced riders with (sometimes) decades under their belt. For the most part you can basically fit yourself on a bike. But I see often enough how very experienced riders get fitted in our shop and are surprised at how many great little tricks they didn't know about. Since the service doesn't actually cost anything but their time, it's a nice little bonus even if you know pretty well how you're going to fit on a bike.
Bang on. And this is what frustrates me about people in the bike industry claiming CRC is ruining their livelihood. You just can't dish out service like that and expect that people want to buy stuff from you.
If nobody helps you with the shoes, then what's the difference between that bike shop and an online shop? The Genius is a high-end shoe, with a high-end price tag at a LBS. It's the sort of thing that comes with the expectation of great service. Even if it's just a matter of shuffling through boxes for your size, giving you some bike socks to try it on with, talking you through the strap mechanism etc etc. It's still pretty basic stuff but it can make a difference. And hopefully that difference means you are happy to pay the premium for the time the LBS has taken to help you fit you, and the fact that they have it in stock to take home with you.
Can't believe this thread is still dredging up the old 'GST/CRC is killing the LBS' woe-is-me rubbish.
It's just a straw man claim used to validate crap service, bad business acumen, and the inability to hire good staff and fire bad ones.
I actually wonder how many bricks and mortar stores have tried talking to their suppliers about a new way of consigning stock?
Someone else mentioned it – our problem is that there are far too many seller-buyer relationships between the manufacturer and end user.
For the record, I've spent over 10k alone thru LBS' and TBSM, and 2k at CRC last year.
My LBS has my needs sorted, they do good by me and most importantly, they know what the fuck they're doing behind the service counter.
It's just a straw man claim used to validate crap service, bad business acumen, and the inability to hire good staff and fire bad ones.
I actually wonder how many bricks and mortar stores have tried talking to their suppliers about a new way of consigning stock?
Someone else mentioned it – our problem is that there are far too many seller-buyer relationships between the manufacturer and end user.
For the record, I've spent over 10k alone thru LBS' and TBSM, and 2k at CRC last year.
My LBS has my needs sorted, they do good by me and most importantly, they know what the fuck they're doing behind the service counter.
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MARKL
Eats Squid
So jealous...we are not even four days into the year (and one of those was a public holiday)
Hahahaha, 2012 I mean. All my mates tell me I'm behind the times lol.
stinky1138
Likes Dirt
It's not just bike shops that have the problem.
My main hobbies are biking, playing with r/c cars, and guitars. All of them bitch about online ruining their business. None really make a good effort of keeping the customer. In each hobby, I've gone to a shop and known more about the product and what i'm looking for than the guy in the shop. Why should I buy from you again ???? The aim should be helping a customer to make the choice or inform them about the product. It seems mostly that you pay for the service of knowledge about the product, and the service is usually not there
My lbs isn't cheap, but their service and knowledge are great, so I buy stuff from them simple as that.
My main hobbies are biking, playing with r/c cars, and guitars. All of them bitch about online ruining their business. None really make a good effort of keeping the customer. In each hobby, I've gone to a shop and known more about the product and what i'm looking for than the guy in the shop. Why should I buy from you again ???? The aim should be helping a customer to make the choice or inform them about the product. It seems mostly that you pay for the service of knowledge about the product, and the service is usually not there
My lbs isn't cheap, but their service and knowledge are great, so I buy stuff from them simple as that.
For the bike industry I'd say someone open up a amazing wheel builders, TWE is my local and that's still a good hour drive but why do I do the drive.
His wheels are frikken amazing, you can't buy that service CRC and I highly doubt any other lbs near me can match him. I did recent buy a bunch of stuff off CRC because for some things it is easier, big parts though and worries of warranty I still buy locally. Im happy to spend 20%more if it's worth it, that means good service and attention to detail with builds, parts, servicing and customer service.
TBSM is a local to myself and for major parts I will go there ussually, there is another store closer that I prefer for servicing and I bought my bike from YVC, I'm all for supporting local but while price is massive factor, for me accessibility and quality is bigger.
YVC was easy to work with over email and we're always prompt with replies and got it all sorted no dramas.
TBSM is a little out of the way but anything that may require warranty and is a decent part I prefer to go local, tbsm have good service, good after product support and good prices.
My local I use for services as I know plenty of people who have had good experience with them and they are accessible easily.
The stores that survive seems to be the ones that are happy to change pricing and happy to change the business up a little whether that is more I online or whatever. I do feel sorry for the stores that are doing all they can and close unfortunately it is not CRC fault it's the raw deal we get with all the different channels to get parts here via imports for sales.
His wheels are frikken amazing, you can't buy that service CRC and I highly doubt any other lbs near me can match him. I did recent buy a bunch of stuff off CRC because for some things it is easier, big parts though and worries of warranty I still buy locally. Im happy to spend 20%more if it's worth it, that means good service and attention to detail with builds, parts, servicing and customer service.
TBSM is a local to myself and for major parts I will go there ussually, there is another store closer that I prefer for servicing and I bought my bike from YVC, I'm all for supporting local but while price is massive factor, for me accessibility and quality is bigger.
YVC was easy to work with over email and we're always prompt with replies and got it all sorted no dramas.
TBSM is a little out of the way but anything that may require warranty and is a decent part I prefer to go local, tbsm have good service, good after product support and good prices.
My local I use for services as I know plenty of people who have had good experience with them and they are accessible easily.
The stores that survive seems to be the ones that are happy to change pricing and happy to change the business up a little whether that is more I online or whatever. I do feel sorry for the stores that are doing all they can and close unfortunately it is not CRC fault it's the raw deal we get with all the different channels to get parts here via imports for sales.
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nathanm
Eats Squid
Funnily enough you can draw some correlations between newspapers and lbs. Due to online content both are facing tough times and downsizing because of it. As far as (what was once called) journalism what we see now are these half-arssed online stories that are sensasionalised with no fact checking, or real unbiased reporting because it's much simpiler for some uni-grad copyrighter to simply type up some bs based on an e-mail or plaguerise someone blog etc.
However living in a relatively small city (Hobart) I get to see several LBS survive not only in a competitive market but in a close physical radius.
I've used them all and now stick to one (Ride Bellerive) due to them having the best mechanic, a 10% discount for myself and my mates. I basically scope out what I want on line, call up the boys and if they're close enough in price, which they usually are, and buy from them. They realise they aren't always the best price and when I do buy from OS they are more than happy to fit the bits for me as this way they still get to make a profit on labour.
So will the local survive, like any retail business the good one's will. There's always the one that makes plenty of money from high end roadies, one from location and like my guys one from just really awesome service.
So adapt or die really. But this is the same tired argument that will go on for ever.
As for the open letter, well really I understand why, but the argument is outdated and symbolises really the opposite of most of his statements.
However living in a relatively small city (Hobart) I get to see several LBS survive not only in a competitive market but in a close physical radius.
I've used them all and now stick to one (Ride Bellerive) due to them having the best mechanic, a 10% discount for myself and my mates. I basically scope out what I want on line, call up the boys and if they're close enough in price, which they usually are, and buy from them. They realise they aren't always the best price and when I do buy from OS they are more than happy to fit the bits for me as this way they still get to make a profit on labour.
So will the local survive, like any retail business the good one's will. There's always the one that makes plenty of money from high end roadies, one from location and like my guys one from just really awesome service.
So adapt or die really. But this is the same tired argument that will go on for ever.
As for the open letter, well really I understand why, but the argument is outdated and symbolises really the opposite of most of his statements.
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hifiandmtb
Sphincter beanie
Here's a relevant story in today's SMH:
http://www.smh.com.au/small-busines...ther-bike-store-struggles-20130104-2c8bd.html
Not much content though.
http://www.smh.com.au/small-busines...ther-bike-store-struggles-20130104-2c8bd.html
Not much content though.
As a former Fairfax employee, I still think the LBS has a chance to turn things around :dance:
StanzaRallyMan
Likes Bikes
My experience with several LBS has been awful.
I needed some headset parts for a project bike. Do all my own research on the parts I need. Find the Aus distributor and confirm they have this part in stock. Go to LBS and give them the exact part number and who the distributor is. Say they will call during the week when the part is in. No call. So I call the distributor and tell them the story and they say deal with another LBS. This is an online bike shop based in Bayswater, Victoria. (you can probably guess which one it is). Send them an email, no reply. Send another email to another email address, again no reply. Call the distributor and tell them, sell the product direct or I'll order it from overseas. They take my money and the part is delivered the next day.
Needed something else so I contact local distributor to see if they will sell direct. No, I need to go to another LBS and order through them. 4 weeks later, I'm still waiting on that phone call to tell me they have got the stock in.
3 LBS, each and everyone could not give a stuff. Each time this happens I think to myself, why do I bother with the LBS? I know what I want, I know the part number, why dont I just order online and have it delivered to my house ready to use?
I wont bother with the LBS anymore.
I needed some headset parts for a project bike. Do all my own research on the parts I need. Find the Aus distributor and confirm they have this part in stock. Go to LBS and give them the exact part number and who the distributor is. Say they will call during the week when the part is in. No call. So I call the distributor and tell them the story and they say deal with another LBS. This is an online bike shop based in Bayswater, Victoria. (you can probably guess which one it is). Send them an email, no reply. Send another email to another email address, again no reply. Call the distributor and tell them, sell the product direct or I'll order it from overseas. They take my money and the part is delivered the next day.
Needed something else so I contact local distributor to see if they will sell direct. No, I need to go to another LBS and order through them. 4 weeks later, I'm still waiting on that phone call to tell me they have got the stock in.
3 LBS, each and everyone could not give a stuff. Each time this happens I think to myself, why do I bother with the LBS? I know what I want, I know the part number, why dont I just order online and have it delivered to my house ready to use?
I wont bother with the LBS anymore.
-An open letter to the LBS-
So my shoes died and I thought I'd try something different. I've never worn any of the brands I was looking at so I thought I'd pay the premium to try them on at the LBS, you know, pay a bit more for a bit of service.
I went to 4 LBS' in the Sydney CBD and best I got was a hello from a bloke who then walked off. All of the shops I went into had free staff, I made sure of that before walking out but it seems they are making so much money that they don't need my measly offering of $300.
So dear LBS, stop f**king whinging that CRC, Wiggle, etc. are killing your business. The only person killing your business is you. The only reason you did better before online shopping was because you had a captive consumer, we didn't have a choice before and had to put up with your $h*tty service.
End rant.
PS. To be fair my LBS near home is actually pretty good, sadly I can't always get to them.
So my shoes died and I thought I'd try something different. I've never worn any of the brands I was looking at so I thought I'd pay the premium to try them on at the LBS, you know, pay a bit more for a bit of service.
I went to 4 LBS' in the Sydney CBD and best I got was a hello from a bloke who then walked off. All of the shops I went into had free staff, I made sure of that before walking out but it seems they are making so much money that they don't need my measly offering of $300.
So dear LBS, stop f**king whinging that CRC, Wiggle, etc. are killing your business. The only person killing your business is you. The only reason you did better before online shopping was because you had a captive consumer, we didn't have a choice before and had to put up with your $h*tty service.
End rant.
PS. To be fair my LBS near home is actually pretty good, sadly I can't always get to them.
jrewing
Eats Squid
Haha...Some funny things I've read today.
mxdame
Likes Dirt
Matt Holmes don't hate on me for buying from CRC, but I am a "micro importer/distributor" with a loyal client base of 1. As much as I love to go to my LBS & get ignored & if i do finally get served, get the privilege of paying a higher price & then told there will be a 4 week wait to get that part in. But this is not unique to the bike industry, Myer cry about net sales too, but try getting served in one of their stores. I don't think anyone would mind paying more if they got some customer service, that's what got people through the doors in years gone by, & now with the net to contend with I would have thought they would be trying harder,not less. LBS's can turn it around but it is up to them to do it.
harmonix1234
Eats Squid
I agree.
I get good service, so I shop at my LBS.
Other shops I have been to give me shit service, so I burn that bridge right then and there.
If there were no shops locally that gave me the level of service that I expect then I would buy it all online.
I'm just thankful that I am so lucky I have a good lbs. Some people aren't so lucky to have access to stores with such a rich knowledge base and attention to a riders needs.
Good on CRC. They have made a good business from ground up.
They sponsor people to ride. They employee heaps of people and create jobs. And, most importantly, they are forcing LBS to do a better job, as they should have in the first place.
CRC will never destroy the BMX industry. It's just that they are a massive corporate entity, and it would seem that anything that is more successful than a backyard independent operation goes against the grass roots style and image of the BMX industry.
BMX is so f*cking indie it makes me want to burn my flanny and frenzal rhomb CD's...
harmonix1234
Eats Squid
Word just in.
I heard that next week Oprah is doing an interview with Matt Holmes.
I heard that next week Oprah is doing an interview with Matt Holmes.