All Mountain bike - what would you recommend?

Hamo

Hamo

Likes Dirt
Well I've been looking into getting an all mountain frame for a while. Probably looking at something with about 6 inches of travel with a pretty slack head angle - good for bombing the downhills.
I've had a look around and done a search but couldn't find much. I recently read the latest AMB (I think the latest) which was great cause it had reviews of what I wanted to buy... but it hardly covered the whole market.
Just wanting to hear from people with experience of different all mountain bikes that might be able to suggest a frame and outline the strengths and weaknesses. (Not looking for "Get a reign they r fully sik" - a bit more than that.)
I've read a few reviews but I would love to hear from people who own them!
 
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smeck

Likes Dirt
Any preferences, and more to the point what's your budget.

My brother and his mate both ride Santa Cruz Nomads with 160mm travel and about the 16kg mark. They climb well enough and certainly descend with a reasonable amount of impunity, and don't seem to have any issues with the changes between the really rocky sections and the loose-over-hardpack corners. Price wise my brothers is an 06 that he picked up for about $2.5k with 8" Juicy 5s, Sram X9 running gear with Saint cranks. They have the slack head angle you mention and a 1 1/2" head tube, but there's slacker bikes out there. I've heard good things about the Bullit, but alas I haven't seen one yet. The mate is a bike mechanic and reckons they're good, but heavy, slack and hard work to get back up the hill.

I ride a 07 SC Blur LT with 135/140mm travel and 12.5kgs. It climbs better but doesn't descend as well as the bigger Nomads, as you would expect. It runs Juicy 5s, XT running gear and carbon ergos and cost me $3k. I can harass the Hard tails going down but the Nomads are long gone. That said the Blur is heaps better on the tight corners and in the rocky sections going up, and is a lot less fatiguing to ride. Its more of an XC bike but it does handle the AM stuff, though its not a slack as the Nomads and retains the 1 1/8" head tube.

Big drop offs aren't really my thing so I can't vouch for that, but its plush on the big rocks and I can ride fire trails when I want to, its a good compromise bike. I looked at a new Reign 0 and an X1 but neither had the same overall quality of the Blur LT. That's purely personal opinion, but I figure when your shelling out that much coin for something you pedal you should be satisfied with the value your getting for your money. Hence if you get the fully sick Reign, or whatever, I understand.

Purely personal thoughts here, but I think the right person on the right bike is hard to beat, regardless of the choice. I just waited until the right bike came along, though some people still have no trouble beating me anyway.

Good luck
 
Hamo

Hamo

Likes Dirt
Sorry, I should have specified: I'm probably looking at getting a frame second hand, so I suppose some of the more boutique frames may not be available second hand. I just wanted to get to know a bit about what's out there, and what people like / dislike about them.. and then see what I might be able to get my hands on.

Thanks alot guys.
 
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RangaRMX

Likes Dirt
Ok, well I'd recommend a Nomad too, but as you're kinda not looking to spend much, probably can skip that one, but they're totally rad and worth all the money IMO...now if only I can get the new Nomad and Jackal I'll be happy..damn sick bikes!

I've currently got an 08 Norco Six, which has a different suspension layout which apparently aids pedaling and suspension performance a whole load over previous models so I'm not referencing the 07 or previous models**

It pedals great for the travel it's got, slightly over 6 inches out back and 7 up the front, and for general trail/AM with a tad of DH/FR this bike is perfect for me. The only gripe I've had is that my Maxle has broken that goes through the back wheel so I'm a bit annoyed that I can't ride ATM, but that's not really bike related, more component and rider related..

You'll find that the Six pedals well for what it's got and descends excellently, plus it's durable enough to jump and take on some quite rough tracks, which is why I bought it actually. I don't mind bikes that are a bit slow to go up, as long as they'll still go up, but I cannot stand a bike that feels skitty and unsafe going back down. My 10kg XC hardtail with 110mm stem feels like the latter, sketchy and dangerous going down, so now that's my hill destroyer, if I ever feel like destroying hills, on the ascent, that is..
 
Hamo

Hamo

Likes Dirt
Thanks Ranga. I can probably afford a high end frame like a nomad, if it's second hand. And your statement about not minding if it's slow up hills, as long as it goes up.. and goes down well is exactly my thinking too. I guess that's the kinda bike I'm looking for, though maybe something a tad lighter than the six.
 
Gruntled

Gruntled

Likes Dirt
I have a Ventana La Bruja frame going very cheap, but without the shock. It's one of the best AM/FR bike out there from one of the best frame makers.
 
v1llage1d1ot

v1llage1d1ot

Likes Dirt
Would you consider getting a hardtail? If so a santa cruz chameleon is hard to beat, and you'd get AWESOME all mountain geo, if you have adjustable forks. It'll handle anything on the way down, without bottoming out, and they climb really well once you get the front down.

For an all mountain build height adjustable forks are pretty much essential.
 
Hamo

Hamo

Likes Dirt
Gruntled - Thanks for the offer, but if it's the bike I think it is - 7 inches of travel would be a bit of over kill.. not really looking for a freeride bike.

Villageidiot - I'm not really looking for a hardtail as I've got a pretty bad back and I find hardtails off road + my hack style stir it up, but thanks for the suggestion. I'm definitely going to have travel adjustable forks... will probably try to pick up some 36 TALAS second hand once I've got a frame.
 
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RangaRMX

Likes Dirt
Hamo said:
Gruntled - Thanks for the offer, but if it's the bike I think it is - 7 inches of travel would be a bit of over kill.. not really looking for a freeride bike.

Villageidiot - I'm not really looking for a hardtail as I've got a pretty bad back and I find hardtails off road + my hack style stir it up, but thanks for the suggestion. I'm definitely going to have travel adjustable forks... will probably try to pick up some 36 TALAS second hand once I've got a frame.
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You might want to think about a newer six, they'll be cheap, well relatively anyway..and aren't heavy really.

Mine weighs in at around 16kg and it's relatively stock, with some pretty burly parts, if you were lighter or weren't after freeride stuff then you could get away with 15kg or under..I run 2.5 minions, and we know they're not the lightest tread you can get. New tread/tubes/wheels would bring the weight down heaps. As I said, I use mine mainly for gravity assisted fun, in saying that I mean I don't care how it rides up hills, as long as I don't have to hold back on the descents...which I don't:)

I'd also be weary of older TALAS forks as I've read their not the smoothest, even the new ones still aren't as nice as older Floats..
 
Beerismyfriend

Beerismyfriend

Likes Dirt
If you're just after a frame, perhaps call Neezey and see what they have kicking around. Pretty sure they have a grey 08 Nomad in a medium that has a few dings in the paint.

My new Nomad arrives this week. Also an 08, but with 36 Talas, dxh air and Saint gear. Nicey nice.
 
ozzybmx

ozzybmx

taking a shit with my boobs out
RangaRMX said:
I get the fact that Nicolai are good frames and all, but seriously there can't be a need for all those model differentiations..I counted over 20..wtf??

BTW I think you need to read more, he probably wont be able to afford any of their frames..let alone build one up!!
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I know they are expensive , i just thought id throw it in as an option if the cash suddenly appeared .

and on the models .... 26 MATE !

They make 1 model of bike for every style , DH , FR , XC , AM , 4X , DJ , Hardtail XC , BMX , cruiser , shopper , commuter , singlespeed , 29er, roadie , folding trail bike , tandems .....ect
The downhill bikes allow you the G-box or normal , heavy downhill , or med/light. Each bike has a purpose , its not like they give you 5 different versions of the same frame in different setups. Every bike added to the Nicolai range was requested for over and over until they reckoned that there was a market for them . Some people wait well over a year for their custom frames. (i wouldnt but some will)
Mine will probably take 10 weeks till i have it in hand , thats only 5 more :D

Look through any manufacturers full list and you will count WAY MORE .... all the classes of MTB , BMX , Roadies .... theres probably 100+ different ones when you start going down the wheel size range too ...eg 16"bmx , 20"bmx, 24"bmx, 26"bmx ...... all for 1 style of frame.

So Nicolai's 26 different frames is nothing in the scheme of things , but thats all they will do . BTW the AM was only released 2008 because of request to fill the gap between the Helius FR (FR bike) and the Helius CC (Trail bike/Xc)

All bikes handmade with a healthy price tag and an even healthier waiting list/time.

I cant see the problem ?
 
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Lorday

Eats Squid
Are you looking for a XC bike that can take DH or a bike to get you to DH section where only XC riders can get, of just something for bombing around trails?
Stumpjumper (06/07), Trek remedy's are good bike. GT force also good (but I have never ridden one!)
 
Hamo

Hamo

Likes Dirt
Thanks guys, some good reading here.
Actually Hamo from Neezy already sent me a message (Thought I had a PM from myself for a bit!). Brand new (even if superseeded model) is a little bit out of my price range. (And for a Nomad I'd probably prefer a small frame, as I like a small bike and I only just fit into the Medium range on the SC sizing chart for them)
Any suggestions are good, cause I guess you never know what's gonna turn up on the second hand market for a bargin price.
I should say: At the moment I'm riding a Trance X (XS) which I originally bought for 4X (Did that twice, and decided I'd rather an AM bike) but with the seatpost at maximum extension it just fits me for XC duties. I find I'd like about an inch more travel (So I could run it nice and squishy) and with a slacker Head angle - It feels quite twitchy to me on the downhills.

Keep the suggestions coming guys!

Edit: just saw your post Lorday. I guess I'm looking for something in between that almost. I already have a downhill bike, but I'd like something that feels more like a downhill bike than a cross country bike on the downhills, but can still ride XC singletrack reasonably comfortably. Hell, if it's a bit heavier than a regular XC bike, I'll just get fitter!
 
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McPete

McPete

Likes Dirt
I've just gone from a STP to a 2008 Regin 0.

I really can't recommend the Reign highly enough.

I'm not nearly as expert as some on here about the workings of suspension systems, but I'll say this; Giant got the Reign very right. The travel is smooth and plush, it keeps the back wheel on the ground when you're bouncing through the rough and it hardly moves enough to notice under a standing climb (That said, I run my ProPedal at the firmest setting).

It's a nice, light frame, so with a reasonable build (i.e the stock one) you're looking at about 13kg of bike, and with some care and a big wallet you could get it lower.

Hooking into a corner was something that I was concerned about the first time I rode the bike on the trail, as it was my first time riding clipped in on the dirt. I shouldn't have worried though, the bike gives you plenty of warning when the rear is about to exit stage left... I've not yet had it come properly unstuck when I wasn't ready for it.

Yes, they are very common, but like a lot of Giants, there's a good reason for it; They work well and don't cost the earth.

P.
 
floody

floody

Wheel size expert
I wouldn't buy an old santa cruz in a pink fit, it will just be a sloppy, creaky, rattly old clunker.


3rd gen Enduro (as in '05-06ish one) ? 150mm rear travel, pretty awesome handling.
I happen to know where $1700 will get you a brand new '06 S-works Enduro frame with DHX5 Air if you'll fit a Small or Medium. Otherwise look for an Enduro Pro or Elite. '06 Pro has DHX5 air too, I think the '05 bikes and the elite have 5ths.
They're quite capable of descending, ask Dirt magazine...
 
The Dude

The Dude

Wasn't asking to be banned
floody said:
I wouldn't buy an old santa cruz in a pink fit, it will just be a sloppy, creaky, rattly old clunker.


Maybe if you were maintaining it..............
I've still got an 04 Blur and it has been no problem at all. It just takes a bit more maintenance than a hardtail or some single pivots I've had previously. If you buy a multi-link bike you have to expect that - the performance more than offsets the neagtives. It's common sense. If they are sloppy (same as any system) or creaking it needs maintanance. If it's maintained correctly, it will have less problems in the long run
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Hamo

Hamo

Likes Dirt
Thanks for that McPete.
Floody - I may look at a second hand enduro - I'm trying to keep costs as low as possible as I'm trying to save for a trip to Europe so I will almost definitely be buying second hand.
 
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