Trump..... (The Sophistry Thread)

Squidfayce

Squidfayce

Eats Squid
crash3 said:
Beat me to it. I know comparisons to Hitler are sometimes overused and passé but the similarities between how Trump and Hitler use(d) their language and platforms to energize populist sentiment is alarming.
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Im not convinced that a similar outcome could be driven by the likes of trump. He's a buffon and even people in his sphere are critical of him. The capitol riots are evidence, at least in my mind, that it would take a lot more that whats currently going on to actuall make this type of history repeat.

We also have lots of moderate and left americans that love their guns that would faster ratehr a civil war again than letting something like WW2 germany repeat. I think that's a more likely scenario
 
Spike-X

Spike-X

Grumpy Old Sarah
Squidfayce said:
trying to find anything that actually details what the documents were, above and beyond just their classifications. anything around?
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Given that some of the stuff seized was apparently so highly classified that even the agents seizing it didn't have the security clearance required to be looking at it, I don't like your chances.
 
crash3

crash3

Likes Dirt
Squidfayce said:
Im not convinced that a similar outcome could be driven by the likes of trump. He's a buffon and even people in his sphere are critical of him. The capitol riots are evidence, at least in my mind, that it would take a lot more that whats currently going on to actuall make this type of history repeat.

We also have lots of moderate and left americans that love their guns that would faster ratehr a civil war again than letting something like WW2 germany repeat. I think that's a more likely scenario
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Yeah absolutely. I deleted a sentance off my post about one of the big differences between Trump and Hitler being that Hitler was more intelligent and that's probably in part why he was able to become an actual dictator white Trump wasn't (although from where I was sitting, good god did he try).

I deleted it because I'm getting well into the 'I'm making a guess on these things based on my very limited understanding of the history and probably my own personal biases' territory. And probably contributing to the sophistry of this thread. But I'm not going for a PhD here, this is an off-topic thread on an MTB forum, so why not post my dumb thoughts eh?
 
Stredda

Stredda

Runs naked through virgin scrub
johnny said:
Let me introduce you to a little thing called history:
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I know, I know, what you said was correct. I just wanted to post pics of what happens when people like Trump stoke feelings of grievance and anger within a section of society who see themselves as more worthy than others.
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It's interesting to see comparisons to Hitler on both sides. The far right use it too.
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Stredda

Stredda

Runs naked through virgin scrub
crash3 said:
My laugh react is probably not the most appropriate to this, but good lord that is an absurd argument.
Vaccinating your child is the same as bringing your child to Auschwitz.
Good golly goshness.
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The flipside is that the type of people using this example are most likely also holocaust deniers as well.

It's also like calling out that having to wear a mask is exactly like the whole communist Chinese regime.
 
johnny

johnny

I'll tells ya!
Staff member
Squidfayce said:
Im not convinced that a similar outcome could be driven by the likes of trump. He's a buffon and even people in his sphere are critical of him. The capitol riots are evidence, at least in my mind, that it would take a lot more that whats currently going on to actuall make this type of history repeat.

We also have lots of moderate and left americans that love their guns that would faster ratehr a civil war again than letting something like WW2 germany repeat. I think that's a more likely scenario
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Hitler didn't launch the third reich on his own, though. Think of all the support and expertise he gained from the likes of Goebbles, Himmler, etc. Trump plays a very similar role as Hitler in that he is the rallying figure that drives and leverages the sense of loss/grievance and places himeslf at the centre as the standard of a man and the saviour of the nation (with underlying messages that the real threat are those among us, such as the immigrants, the media/immigrants/LGBTQMarxists/communists/handicapped/poor/etc.)

The fact that Trump, without the support of his inner circle, was able to rally the mob and create his version of the Brown Shirts in the Proud Boys only further supports the comparison. I have no idea if Trump has studies history but I doubt it. I'd say that he's simply the same kind of person as Mussolini, Hitler, et al, in that he has a big ego to satisfy and no moral limits to bound the effort.

Stredda said:
It's interesting to see comparisons to Hitler on both sides. The far right use it too.
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Yeah, I'd say that based on facts, those that are applying it to the far right are more accurate. However, some of the comparisons the right are making of the far left to Stalin and Mao aren't far off the mark either. Through my research I come across a lot of the new left and it's astounding how much support and excuse-making there is out there for what Xi and Putin are doing.

Take a look at the Twitter feeds of people like John Pilger and Peter Cronau. And check out these supporters of the Chinese communist party http://www.cowestpro.co/papers.html If you really want to find out how low these fuckers are, dig into what they did to Vicky Xu and Drew Pavlou.

Extreme views and ideological fundamentalists of any stripe are trouble.
 
fatboyonabike

fatboyonabike

Captain oblivious
You can almost hear his thought patterns.
"Yeah, I have a Skiff at Mar A Lago, A Really nice Skiff, Probably the best anybody has ever seen...I can keep the documents under the seat where they wont get wet!!"
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Lazmo

Lazmo

Old and hopeless
johnny said:
Extreme views and ideological fundamentalists of any stripe are trouble.
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100%.

As lefty as I am personally, there is no shortage of eff wits on either side of the divide.

The older I get, the less time I have for dominant people.

I think the dominant need to promulgate your own view, be it politics or religion or dogma or workplace, is pathetic and intrinsically hopeless, a true sign of weakness and an inate inability to acknowledge and accept alternative viewpoints.

I mean, think what you like, but don’t for one moment think that everyone else should do the same.

It’s just so bizarre that is pretty much the biggest conundrum we face.

It’s all in peoples minds.

And it is not even real.
 
Spike-X

Spike-X

Grumpy Old Sarah
Spike-X said:
Given that some of the stuff seized was apparently so highly classified that even the agents seizing it didn't have the security clearance required to be looking at it, I don't like your chances.
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And given that the Department Of Justice wants to keep the search warrant affidavit sealed, your chances just became zero.

The search warrant affidavit contains “highly sensitive information” that could compromise the “ongoing law enforcement investigation that implicates national security,” they wrote in a court filing.
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www.cnbc.com

DOJ urges judge to keep Trump search warrant affidavit sealed to protect national security investigation

Federal prosecutors investigating former President Donald Trump asked a judge not to unseal an affidavit related to the FBI's search of Trump's Mar-a-Lago home.
www.cnbc.com www.cnbc.com
 
H

Halo1

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Trump has Ghislaine Maxwell’s client list stored on Hilliard Clinton’s spare email server. This is what all the fuss is about.
 
Squidfayce

Squidfayce

Eats Squid
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