Steel regret

Jpez

Down on the left!
I’ve got an NS Eccentric chromo that I love like it’s my firstborn. I never wish it was lighter and faster or made of aluminium. I don’t wear Lycra and go for uphill KOM’s but it goes uphills very well. When I come off my 160 full squish it feels like a light XC bike.
It was the first real bike I built from frame up. Made a bunch of mistakes and learnt a few lessons along the way.
It handles the rough stuff really really well and also became my saviour during lockdown as my bike path bike.
it’s also helped teach my kid to ride by carrying her on the Macride and then her chasing me on her own bikes.
All this is irrelevant to the question asked but I can’t talk about my NS without getting all misty eyed.
So I will never sell this bike. I have no interest whatsoever in changing it out for a lighter aluminium bike. What was the question again?

If the OP is thinking about a steel frame then stop thinking and just buy it. I promise you’ll have no ‘Ragerts.’
 

Asininedrivel

caviar connoisseur
The Paradox lives up to its name when it comes to ride feel and is a total outlier IMO. No idea how they got it feeling that good, but it's an amazing thing. Not encountered many other nice feeling ally hardtails.
This weirds me out as I was immune to the Paradox initially as it was alloy - all the alloy hardtails I've ridden have been pretty harsh. Does the Paradox feel like a steel frame?
 

Calvin27

Eats Squid
Has anyone bought a steel framed bike and regretted it? Like you just wished it was made from aluminum to be lighter? Yes I am aware that tons of people have bought and love their steel mountain bikes.
I hated my charge cooker. It was probably more of an early 29er thing and a bunch of other non frame related stuff. he head tube was a weird size so could only run straight steerers, the chainstays were a shape such that it would always chip on the outside. Didn't really feel the compliance or any of that, I think when you have 2.0"tyres and beyond it's a bit pointless to talk about frame compliance.

I also rekon you have to be a certain type of rider (and level) to get the most out of these things. Modern alu is quite good and I rekon in blind tests, you won't even pick it. Frame material is like the most overcooked thing imo and I've basically tried them all including bamboo.
 

beeb

Dr. Beebenson, PhD HA, ST, Offset (hons)
This weirds me out as I was immune to the Paradox initially as it was alloy - all the alloy hardtails I've ridden have been pretty harsh. Does the Paradox feel like a steel frame?
I've only ridden one around on some firetrail and over some small rocks, but it felt weirdly good. Compliance felt basically the same as my Waltly, which from my experience and others that have swung a leg over it seems to sit somewhere between aluminium and steel in terms of frame feel in that it's firm, but doesn't have that typical aluminium-frame buzz when you hit a sharp edge, or on the better end of alu frames - when the frame reaches maximum deflection. I'd be interested to take a Paradox for a proper ride, but yeah - changed my expectation of what can be achieved with an alloy frame (it's still a hardtail though! haha).
 

Tubbsy

Packin' a small bird
Staff member
Haven't built my Paradox up yet, but hefting the frame in hand it feels surprisingly weighty - I wonder if not going for the lightest possible construction has a bearing here?

I'm no engineer, and that theory sounds counterintuitive, but it's impressive if all that was needed to achieve the compliance is the little cutout sections in the stays.
 

Halo1

Likes Bikes and Dirt
There's a difference, but it's only marginal. Personally i think the hype is exaggerated. I like how @Scotty675 banshee paradox rides more than my honzo, but it also has a longer fork on it
You are wrecking the hype dude. :)
I tend to agree and it depends on the frame build. At 100 + kgs I am guessing I might get more of the frame flex feel then some one much lighter. It would be interesting to compare the exact same geo numbers in different materials. I once rode a carbon HT and it was awful but that was more the xc geo.
 

Jpez

Down on the left!
You are wrecking the hype dude. :)
I tend to agree and it depends on the frame build. At 100 + kgs I am guessing I might get more of the frame flex feel then some one much lighter. It would be interesting to compare the exact same geo numbers in different materials. I once rode a carbon HT and it was awful but that was more the xc geo.
That’s a really good point about the body weight helping with frame compliance. I’m about 95kegs and sometimes I forget there’s no suspension out back. So much so I end up smashing tyres and blowing them out from hitting stuff too hard. Have to remind myself it’s still a hardtail.

I owned a Scott Scale a few years back and it was quick and light. But boy was it harsh. But it wasn’t designed for the sort of riding I like to do.
 

beeb

Dr. Beebenson, PhD HA, ST, Offset (hons)
Modern alu is quite good and I rekon in blind tests, you won't even pick it. Frame material is like the most overcooked thing imo and I've basically tried them all including bamboo.
I reckon the different materials do have slightly different feel, but ultimately it all comes down to the frame construction and builder's skills. It's amazing how good the aluminium frames are getting though.
 

The Reverend

Likes Bikes and Dirt
The Paradox lives up to its name when it comes to ride feel and is a total outlier IMO. No idea how they got it feeling that good, but it's an amazing thing. Not encountered many other nice feeling ally hardtails. Some of the better ones are alright over small chatter, but tend to still have a bit of "buzz" when clattering over chunkier rocks, or bounce the back wheel a bit more sharply. Subtle differences, but it's the difference between confidence and tenseness for me.
Can confirm. It's a keeper.
 

The Reverend

Likes Bikes and Dirt
This weirds me out as I was immune to the Paradox initially as it was alloy - all the alloy hardtails I've ridden have been pretty harsh. Does the Paradox feel like a steel frame?
I don't know if it feels like steel but it's much more supple than any hardtail I remember riding.

If I only had one bike to ride, I'd be happy on that for almost everything I ride. Especially with a long travel, quality damped fork.
 

Daniel Hale

She fid, he fid, I fidn't
didn’t rate Ti when i had it - overrated imo for bike frames, certainly not worth the extra cost

should not have got rid of my first proper mtb - kona unit ss steel , now have a soma with tange prestige to console myself on - both orange
 

HamboCairns

Thanks for all the bananas
Steve from Hardtail Party said he preferred the Big Al over the Big Wig, with the Big Al being close in feel to his Paradox. High praise indeed!
 

mooboyj

Likes Dirt
I love my NS Surge Evo and will never sell it. I DJ it, raced XCX with it and will be racing it in an Enduro next month. It is steel and feels great. I use it as my do all muck around bike and it works for everything.

I also have the alloy equivalent (NS Clash) and it feels great as well. I commute on this one and have raced XC and done multiple black runs back in Perth on it. It is great and doesn't feel harsh either.
 

Art Vanderlay

Hourly daily
Kona Unit 2011, all original except now has hydraulic brakes. Don't ride it a lot, but love it. Contemplated selling it a number of times but is a keeper now. Usually take this on adventures with the kids.
 
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