Mavic 317 tubeless conversion frustration

[Pube]

I have been riding the local trails for around 12 months now and bought a Giant Trance X2 for a few months now and am very happy with my purchase. Having got a few flats recently I thought I would look into converting over to a tubeless tyre system. I figure If I dont have to carry a spare tube, and levers, and not get flats...that would be great!

I did some research and bought some Maxxis Ignitor UST 2.35 tyres. I used the 20inch BMX tube conversion using Spax mountain bike latex sealant to keep costs down and I have read people use this setup quite successfully. The conversion went fairy smoothly, the only real issue was getting the tyre to initially inflate which was achieved using an air compressor with a bit of persistance to get the bead of the tyre to seat.

First ride was out at Appin which went well with nil leakage. I few days later I rode the trails at Menai where it all came undone. I managed to have a small fall when attempting a smallish drop off (big enough for me) where on landing the bike went one way and I went the other. Thats when the problem started....

The front tyre appears to have taken some side load where some dirt got between the rim/tube and tube/tyre. This resulted in latex leaking out everywhere and not sealing at all. Initially my first thoughts were just to clean out the dirt, pump the tyre back up and off we go. That didnt happen. I just couldnt get the tyre to inflate again! Lucky my mate had a spare tube which got us home.

Thinking back to the initial fitment, the tyre seemed to not sit too well especially around the valve where the tube has the extra reinforcing layers. So back to the drawing board using the 20inch BMX tubes, I thought I would try a different method since they failed on my second ride. Second time round I opted for some good quality electrical tape to seal the spoke holes and bought a Stans tubeless valve. Initial fitment looked the goods but I came back the the same problem with the tyre not seating the bead very well at all, again especially around the valve. This makes inflation using a pump impossible.

So whats going on here? I know I can inflate the tyre using a compressor but thats useless to me in the bush. The rims im using are narrow Mavic 317's, standard issue with the Trance X2 (with standard 2.10 tyres). Are my 2.35 UST tyres too wide for the narrow rim resulting in poor fitment of the bead? Even with no tube or valve, just the tyre and the rim, the fitment of the bead isnt the best.

Where do I go from here? I have spend money on tyres, valves, sealant...do I persist?

 

[SB]

In my experience with tubeless, a track pump is the minimum pump size to inflate a unseated bead and a compressor is ideal. Inflation to a higher pressure for bead seating, overnight is good, and lower to riding pressure later.
I would just carry a spare tube in case of a flat and do the repairs at home.

 

[BM Epic]

My initial thought when reading this is the tyres are too big to go with the mavic 317's, these wheels are usually pretty good at running tubeless tyres, my daughter runs them with 2.0 crossmarks with no problem whatsoever(the seal is fantastic).
My other thought would have been to run a stans kit from the very start, but i think the 2.35's will turn out to be a cause of the problem.
Other people may have different opinions!

 

[tim3638]

Persist
I have been running DIY yourself tubeless for over 2 years on multiple bikes using the 20 inch tube method and at times have been annoyed like yourself. I have found the end seal depends on a number of factors.

1) The tire and tube is important, if the tyre seems too loose try applying a layer or two of electrical tape underneath.

2) What you put in your sealant mix. I use liquid latex (from a craft shop), slime, water and window cleaner at a ratio of approx 30ml, 15ml, 5ml, 5ml.

3) The sealing process (this is crucial) use warm soapy water. Once the tyre is inflated give the wheel some quick rotation to spread the sealant. Then spend time moving sealant to the areas you can hear see sealant leaking. Over the next few hours I lay the wheel on its side (leaning on something so it is level) and rotate it on its side every 15 minutes so the bead really gets a chance to seal well.

As this is DIY process it can be hit and miss. My worst attempts have needed to be reworked before the first ride but my more successful attempts have lasted around 2 years. I would also advise against letting the tire deflate as the weight on the beads can break the seal.

 

[hathill]

317 Rims Tubeless

My initial thought when reading this is the tyres are too big to go with the mavic 317's, these wheels are usually pretty good at running tubeless tyres, my daughter runs them with 2.0 crossmarks with no problem whatsoever(the seal is fantastic).
My other thought would have been to run a stans kit from the very start, but i think the 2.35's will turn out to be a cause of the problem.
Other people may have different opinions!

Hey Todd - did you run these with or without rim strips?

 

[XYGTHO]

I would recommend carrying a spare tube anyway when running tubeless. You can still slice your tyre or something riding which won't seal. I'd persist also. My setup was a pain initially but no flats in 6months, just top my sealant up through the valve every few months and that's it. Maybe try the original tyres that came with the trance. I run non tubeless tyres that have been fine.

 

[The Duckmeister]

I reckon the fat tyre could be a part of the problem. 317 are basically a XC rim, so fat tyres would probably tend to bag out & not lock in particularly well.

Side note: ALWAYS carry a spare tube when riding, even when setup tubeless.

 

[ChopSticks]

I reckon the fat tyre could be a part of the problem. 317 are basically a XC rim, so fat tyres would probably tend to bag out & not lock in particularly well.

Side note: ALWAYS carry a spare tube when riding, even when setup tubeless.

+1



my first set of decent wheels had 317 rims, and I ran ghetto tubesless with them no issues...only problem I did have was using non-UST tyres which were so thin, sealant constantly seeped out of them

I say save the money and buy a nice stans kit with the tubeless rim strips and use their sealant !!

 

[disappearin]

I've run specialized tubeless ready tyres in a 2.2s and maxxis non tubeless 2.1s on the 317's without issue. I found rim tape (duct tape in my case) to work better than a 20in tube. You really need to make sure the bead is seated all the way around the rim. Sometimes this means pumping it up, letting it down 3-4 times till it all pops into place. I usually don't go much over 40psi when doing this as I've had a couple tyres pop off the rim.
What tyre pressures are you running? At low pressures tyres will burp easier and can cause what you described to happen. You can often get them to pump back up with a co2 canister on the trail in these cases.

 

[ethan_white]

In my experience with tubeless, a track pump is the minimum pump size to inflate a unseated bead and a compressor is ideal. Inflation to a higher pressure for bead seating, overnight is good, and lower to riding pressure later.
I would just carry a spare tube in case of a flat and do the repairs at home.

Good idea, great