Is Fox Live Valve suspension akin to e-Biking?

Tubbsy

Packin' a small bird
Staff member
So Fox have released an electronic adaptive suspension system to their lineup.


live valve 1.jpg
live valve 2.jpg



https://www.ridefox.com/content.php?c=livevalve-bike

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/review-fox-live-valve-suspension.html

Tech sounds quite interesting, and the reviewer seems to like it. A couple of passages made me think of e-Biking arguments:


"the system responds so quickly that the hand-off between open and closed feels seamless. I was lulled into believing that nothing was going on until I realized that every root and rock that I was rolling over on my way up the mountain felt like it was the same size. They weren't."

"Live Valve opens when G-forces hit its preset threshold with such precision that all initial impacts feel about the same. I was banging into an array of rocks and roots ranging in size up to five inches, but at the grips, my 36 fork's four-G threshold setting made the bike feel like I was rolling over a continuous web of small, two-inch-diameter (50mm) roots."

"It took a while before I stopped pausing momentarily to transfer my saddle position forwards at the onset of every climb. That was no longer a necessity. The only times I needed to break my pedaling cadence and move my weight around on the saddle was for more technical ascents or steep, punchy climbs - and even then, the stability the system added to my already sharp climbing Mach 5.5 was remarkable. I also could pedal more smoothly up chunky section because the controller allows the fork and shock to respond independently in climb mode, which keeps the rear wheel driving, and the front of the bike tracking, instead of skipping over the chunder."



Given quite a few anti e-Bike arguments centre around de-skilling and dumbing down the riding experience by making it easier to power over obstacles, do we feel this sits on the side of better suspension performance, or sanitising the ride?
 
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Ultra Lord

Hurts. Requires Money. And is nerdy.
Given quite a few anti e-Bike arguments centre around de-skilling and dumbing down the riding experience by making it easier to power over obstacles, do we feel this sits on the side of better suspension performance, or sanitising the ride?
Deskilling has already happened, hahaha.

So many big trail bikes piloted by shit riders on tame trails. Poor doods bobbing their way around the trails working hard to get undersprung bikes up to speed then get smashed by the next pinch climb.

I won’t run it, too tightarse and don’t want the extra hassle when things break. Too much going on with mtbs already damnit, know wheres my coil forked ss........
 
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scblack

Leucocholic
If it is not providing power to the wheels its not an e-bike. Do you consider road bikes with electronic gears e-bikes?
 

Oddjob

Merry fucking Xmas to you assholes
It will probably be as reliable and excellent as BMW's similar system for its motorbikes... i.e. a total dog.

That money would be better spent on custom suspension tuning and coaching.

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scblack

Leucocholic
Did you read my post?
Glanced quickly, not very well.

I think it will be too expensive to be considered for sanitising a ride. The kind of person who wanted a softer ride would not be so likely to spend the time or money on this. It could for sure improve suspension performance - but I imagine more for the XC crowd. I like DH/gravity riding and think this would be a limited improvement on a DH track.
 

Tubbsy

Packin' a small bird
Staff member
@scblack @Zaf It does sound a bit like a Specialized Brain product for XC racers, but the Pinkbike guy seems to pitch it toward longer travel bikes:

"Live Valve is going to find its home on high-performance trail bikes with generous amounts of wheel travel that are owned by enthusiast-level riders who already own a high-end machine and want a better bike for their next purchase."

Although I can imagine it would be effective for top level XC racers given the look of some of the courses these days. Some courses seem to alternate between cyclocross tracks and this kind of thing, so I can imagine they'd appreciate it?


NINO-Rock-Garden.jpg
 
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Binaural

Eats Squid
If it's not providing power, it's basically just another improvement in suspension technology. It's no worse than making 160mm bikes rideable on most trails due to improved linkage designs. People will compensate by riding rougher and nastier trails over time.

Somewhat appropos to this thread, one of our early customers of some of my company's motion sensing products was Bose's skunk works, who were dabbling in active suspension design. It's still around! This is the next level again for actively-controlled valves.
https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/259042-bose-sells-off-revolutionary-electromagnetic-suspension

At 1:30, you will see a passenger sedan equipped with this system bunnyhop an obstacle. I wish I was joking:
 

hifiandmtb

Sphincter beanie
I think this is the start of suspension advancement for the better, quite frankly.

You can never, ever underestimate the awesomeness of honed damping. I spend a lot of time getting my cars just so. This is the next level for mountain bikes...without this sort of continuous feedback, it's difficult to have the "correct" level of damping present at all times.

Bring it on!
 

Oddjob

Merry fucking Xmas to you assholes
If only someone could come up with something like a regressive damper, that has a clever blow off that responds to trail input without the need or complicated and expensive electronics. Then you would have a strong pedaling platform, that would open up the moment a certain blow-off pressure threshold is met giving you all the advantages of both.
Huh!? Did someone call my name?


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