Hardtail or Dually

[Mad Hatter]

Gotta keep it stiff!

Hardtail for me.
I`ve never felt comfortable on a dually. I think mainly because the ones that I`ve had a chance to ride have not been set up for a BFC like me, so I found the bikes awkward. Not good when the person setting the bike up says, "yep, that looks good" and of you go and then they expect you to fork out $$$$$ for it.
I ride an alloy HT and a steel fully rigid SS. The fully rigid SS is by far the most fun to ride.
I`d be happy if someone lent me a decent dually set up properly and I might change my mind, but with what I`ve ridden, it`s not for me.
Cheers
MH

 

[JK81]

Dual all the way

For my money, it's dually all the way. Nothing like having a full sus frame to suck up some of the decent on your way back down. I totally understand the dedication to the old days but with the engineering coming on so much in the last 15 years, how could you go for anything but a dually?

I still remember my first day on a dual sus after year's of getting a compressed spine thanks to a hard tail. Like hammering down a mountain on a cloud, but much much faster.

 

[SilverSP]

Dually all the way for me too.

I learnt to ride on HT's over the years and my last HT bike was a Mongoose 7.1 which I had for a few months until it was stolen. I was deciding at the time when I brought it to go the Mongoose NX 8.1 dually in a small frame which cost $2k or the 7.1 which cost half that back in 2000.
Once I got the the insurance payout on the old one I went back and brought the 8.1 as I always wanted dual.

I enjoyed the 8.1 but never really had the full confidence on it as I was hunched over the handle bars as the seat was up high and this also made it unconformable to ride after a few hours.
I didnt know about frame sizes back then.
When the frame cracked a few months back, I wasn't allowed to blow another $2k+ on another so I brought a 08 Mongoose Teocali in a Large frame for $640 off Ebay which is in good condition apart from the brakes which I replaced with XT's and some minor gearing issues which I sorted myself. It's not perfect but for the price who cares..

It's given back to me the confidence I was lacking for downhills and technical on the NX and at my age the plush ride helps as well. The bike isnt a lightweight (1kg lighter than the NX) but nor am I.
I enjoy riding the bike as it feels "fun" in spades which is something the old one lacked.
It's a mo-fo climbing sealed roads though and I guess thats the Nevagal tyres it came with but it's brilliant offroad and leaves the old one for dead. No excessive rear bob helps too.
The frame prob isn't right for me either (I'm 5'11) but prefer it to a small bike.

So I learnt that even Duallys aren't created equal and I'm sure that the modern bikes will leave the Teo for dead as well but until I break it, it stays. Helensburgh were I am is full of rocky loose stoned and hilly firetrails so something to help the comfort level is a bonus for me

 

[palana]

Throw another 10cents in the cookie jar for this thread. I rode a carbon 26er HT for the last 10 years and would say that with the speed in which technology/componets are moving, a dually really is the answer, the 26er vs 29er is another debate.

I have found with my HT that not being a 15QR was becoming more difficult to hang with duallies, and if I were to continue with a HT it would be 29er.

+1 for dually.

 

[Zam]

Throw another 10cents in the cookie jar for this thread. I rode a carbon 26er HT for the last 10 years and would say that with the speed in which technology/componets are moving, a dually really is the answer, the 26er vs 29er is another debate.

I have found with my HT that not being a 15QR was becoming more difficult to hang with duallies, and if I were to continue with a HT it would be 29er.

+1 for dually.

Yeah i have to agree here, when i first started getting back into riding about 6yrs ago i opted for a HT which i have loved and it was pretty light coming it at about 11kg although i could go lower...then the Duallies just really didnt feel right and i dont think they had the suspension quite right and they seem to get a fair bit of bob going when peddling, unless the ones i rode just werent setup properly.

Anyways, now i have gone a duallie and from the quick couple of rides i have been on i am absolutely loving it and think once i get it setup for me it will be much quick and although 2kg heavier than my HT i think i should be able to get that down to somewhere closer, but for now i am happy with it.

SO..........................+ 1 for duallie

 

[strezd]

I couldn't make up my mind on the ht vs ds that's partly the reason Im getting the Scott genius.
With the push of a lever I get full dual suspension, rear lockout or front and back lock out. I'm surprised more bikes don't have this.

 

[Boxer]

I couldn't make up my mind on the ht vs ds that's partly the reason Im getting the Scott genius.
With the push of a lever I get full dual suspension, rear lockout or front and back lock out. I'm surprised more bikes don't have this.

Whilst I ride 29er dually - I would never compare lockout to a HT responsiveness.

HT's are far more responsive still and even in lockout a dually removes alot of the trail chatter. The initial bump compliance is still there in lockout and the big hits will blow through it - move your travel indicating ring to the bottm and ride and see just how much its still moves

I ahev ridden enough HT's to know there are still the king of response and climbing and am considering adding one to my stable as well as the dually

 

[Webby82]

I love my hard tail, however, I am looking at crossing over to the soft side.... Gotta fork out a few more dollars though to get the ride I am after. Hope it is worth it.

 

[RoyAL]

I grew up racing on HT bikes, back in the days when an XC race happened on the same day as the DH race as the hillclimb TT and it was all done on the same bike, whith front elastomer Manitous if you were lucky.... Anyway, HT teaches you good trailcraft, you really do learn to pick a line, you have to or you will die! Fast forward to now and some riders only ever ride dual suspensions, I honestly think they loose something when it comes to the way you ride. That said, there is something awfully nice to being able to boost off something rather than having to skirt around an obstacle on a HT..... Considering changing to a Dualie myself - getting old and it is nice to sit down throught stuff rather than stand up and suffer.

 

[Old C]

I still remember the huge change from HT to Dually, and said I would never go back. A couple of years later, broke the Dually, and had to dust off the HT; I think I must have lost some skills, as that HT bucked and kicked all the way round the track; I hope I never have to ride a HT again.

But to be comparable for speed on the race track, the Dually needs to be a big investment, as pedal induced bob will slow you down. A genius is not the answer, as that thing is seriously heavy.

Don't confuse race breed Duallies with all mountain bikes, they are very different.

 

[megrpirate]

Its dually all the way for me. Came from bmxing which is fun on a smooth skatepark but anything slightly rough and all you get is a spinal tap.
Got a xc dually recently and absolutely loving it.

 

[The Duckmeister]

A tad over four years ago when I decided to migrate from road to dirt, I tossed up the HT vs duallie debate too, having heard the bit about how a HT teaches more bike-handling skills. In the end it was actually the search for technical knowledge that swayed me to a duallie; I work in a bike shop, and as a then-roadie, I didn't know that much about suspension setup & tuning. So I figured the best way to learn was to get a duallie so I could play around with it and get a feel of what works & what doesn't. The bike I got was a 2008 Giant Anthem. As usually happens, it's not the same spec now as it was then.... Still loving the bike, and with a tendency towards longer rides, I'm not really in any great hurry to jump onto a HT.

 

[M0z]

[...]

HT's are far more responsive still and even in lockout a dually removes alot of the trail chatter. The initial bump compliance is still there in lockout and the big hits will blow through it - move your travel indicating ring to the bottm and ride and see just how much its still moves

[...]

I ride an aging scott scale... i should say, USED to ride an aging scott scale ...just recently picked up a spark... when i lockout the rear shock i swear to god it's rock solid... i don't feel it removing any of the trail chatter... it feels a bit flexier "back there" when hammering out of the saddle while locked out, but that's lateral flex and i think that has more to do with the lighter wheels... perhaps it's because the bike is still so new... i don't know...

but i'm certainly starting to love the move to DS (i'm still getting used to mine) the twinloc lever on my handlebars initially annoyed the hell out of me... but the convenience is fantastic... and i defiantly think it totally transforms the bike. I'm just having issues with the rockshox fork's over the fox's i was used to. I think having the lockout is the best of both worlds... and... this bike is dangerously close to the same weight as my scale was... although admittedly i had to change a few components to get it there.

 

[Bushranger]

I wonder how many folks go from FS back to carbon HT 29er....

Given that single speed seems to be on the rise - I would assume folks going for the simple life.

I reckon if not already we may see a bit of a swing back to HT's of the Carbon 29er flavour.

 

[dano_mtb]

well I own both. A 29er Carbon hardtail and a Carbon 26inch all mountain/trail dually.

With the hardtail I am super fast on the flats and flowy sections. Climbing is phenomenal. The bike just makes you want to get out of the saddle and sprint more,its not a sit and spin type of bike. The cons are that its not the best when the trail gets rough and choppy. You really need to pick your lines and take it easy when its nasty.It doesn't like anything over 2 foot drops and cornering is OK.

With the dually It can handle pretty much everything. The nastier and more technical the better.Jumps,drops and cornering is way more fun. The cons are that long smooth climbs are tiresome, shorts climb bursts are fine but longer climbs suck. When just cruising along it can feel slow and lazy,it really needs to be constantly ridden hard to get the most out of it.

So I wrekon get a hardtail if you like to ride fast on flatter sections, power up hills and your trails dont have to many drops and jumps. Also if you like to ride your bike on the roads aswell.
Get a DS if you wana be abit of a "hoon" and like to pop off any bump and tackle the fun stuff with no worries. But take it easy on climbs with a sit and grind away style and pretty much only use the bike for trail riding and not road aswell.

 

[Blackstar]

I prefer duallies. More comfortable.

 

[craigjurisevic]

Young= hard tail. Old= dually

I raced XC from 1993-95 after road racing from 1983-90.
Ran all the time and then got back into XC in 2012. I'm 47 now and and hardtails hammered my back on the rocky tech trails.

So, if you're over 40 I recommend a dually. We have to look after these ageing joints if they're going to see the distance!

 

[goog64]

I wonder how many folks go from FS back to carbon HT 29er....

Given that single speed seems to be on the rise - I would assume folks going for the simple life.

I reckon if not already we may see a bit of a swing back to HT's of the Carbon 29er flavour.

Sounds like you're talking to me!
I have ridden a Santa Cruz Heckler 26" dually for 16 years (Yes, 16! For you youngsters, Hecklers back then were a lot different bike from Hecklers now.) The bike is awesome. It's still going strong and it's great to ride. Last year, I thought bikes must have come such a long way in 15 years that I just had to upgrade. So I tried a bunch of modern duallies and not one of them was considerably better than my old Heckler.
Anyway, this year I tried again. I bought a hard tail 29er (XTC composite), and this time there is a considerable difference. I ride single speed and the climbs are a lot easier. It's also bumpier, but not as much as I thought it would be. I think the carbon and the 29" wheels help a lot. I'm buying carbon bars and seatpost to try and take some more edge off the bumps, but the question is, will my 49 year old back hold up, or will I return to the trusty Heckler next year? The Dirtworks 100 in May will give me some good data. Stay tuned!

Why did I buy a HT? I like simple and low maintenance. Even though I've done almost zero maintenance on the Heckler in 16 years, I don't even like the "threat" of maintenance. Guess I'm getting old and lazy. Now I'm even thinking of a carbon fork.

 

[moorey]

Hecklers back then were a lot different bike from Hecklers now .

Mate just bought one..not that different at all from 16 years ago. Sweet then, sweet now. If any bike has changed in the last 16 years, its not the Heckler.
Are you planning to sell me yours?

 

[goog64]

If any bike has changed in the last 16 years, its not the Heckler.

When I read your comment, I thought I'd get a photo of an old one and a new one to prove how much they've changed - but you're right, they haven't changed much at all really.
I'm not sure what I was thinking - I thought they'd gone to MUCH longer travel and a completely different suspension system. Oh well, soon I'll be able to hide my own easter eggs.

It sure is a great bike and I do have one to sell, now that you mention it. I have 2 of them (a large and a medium), but I'm definitely keeping one. Doesn't matter which.