Electric Vehicles etc

Stredda

Runs naked through virgin scrub
Those extruded aluminium bikes we all ride can be problematic to make. Just saw this and wondered where to post, seems like a good place, with a bit of sarcasm :) Pretty scary though.

Holy shit that's a bad day at work!
Looks like it's blown a hydraulic line but that bright spray just before everything goes apocalyptic would be high pressure aluminium! :oops:
 

Haakon

Call me Ken, whoreken
Model Y now open for orders in Australia. About 6K dearer than the 3.

Estimated delivery Augusts - November 2022 - faster than a new order 3.
 

k3n!f

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Shame they haven't released the Long Range in Australia, that is the one that I want.

Anyone know how long it was between the Model 3 being released and the Long Range version arriving in Australia?
 

tubby74

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Bit annoying people who ordered some versions of the model 3 last year are still waiting yet they're now offering the y in the same timeframe. The base Y includes the better sound system that only comes with the LR and P 3 models. I did consider swapping the order this morning but was still thinking about it when the window blew out.
 

Haakon

Call me Ken, whoreken
Bit annoying people who ordered some versions of the model 3 last year are still waiting yet they're now offering the y in the same timeframe. The base Y includes the better sound system that only comes with the LR and P 3 models. I did consider swapping the order this morning but was still thinking about it when the window blew out.
Dont sweat it. Lots of retrofit kits for the stereo that use the unused speaker and sub locations in the base model that sound better than the upgrade factory system.
 

ozzybmx

call me Cáitín
Seen this, don't know the origin or the facts to back it up as it Vic.

----------------------------------------

Charging Electric Cars MELBOURNE
We recently did some work for the body corporate at the Dock 5 Apartment Building in Docklands in Melbourne to see if we could install a small number of electric charging points for owners to charge their electric vehicles. We had our first three applications. We discovered:
  1. Our building has no non- allocated parking spaces ie public ones. This is typical of most apartment buildings so we cannot provide shared outlets.
  2. The power supply in the building was designed for the loads in the building with virtually no spare capacity. Only 5 or 6 chargers could be installed in total in a building with 188 apartments!!
  3. How do you allocate them as they would add value to any apartment owning one. The shit fight started on day one with about 20 applications received 1st day and many more following.
  4. The car park sub-boards cannot carry the extra loads of even one charger and would have to be upgraded on any floors with a charger as would the supply mains to each sub board.
  5. The main switch board would then have to be upgraded to add the heavier circuit breakers for the sub mains upgrade and furthermore:
  6. When Docklands was designed a limit was put on the number of apartments in each precinct and the mains and transformers in the streets designed accordingly. This means there is no capacity in the Docklands street grid for any significant quantity of car chargers in any building in the area.
  7. It gets better. The whole CBD (Hoddle Grid, Docklands)and Southbank is fed by two sub stations. One in Port Melbourne and one in West Melbourne. This was done to have two alternate feeds in case one failed or was down for maintenance. Because of the growth in the city /Docklands and Southbank now neither one is now capable of supplying the full requirement of Melbourne zone at peak usage in mid- summer if the other is out of action. The Port Melbourne 66,000 volt feeder runs on 50 or 60 year old wooden power poles above ground along Dorcas Street South Melbourne. One is pole is located 40 cm from the corner Kerb at the incredibly busy Ferrars /St Dorcas St Intersection and is very vulnerable to being wiped out by a wayward vehicle.
  8. The infrastructure expenditure required would dwarf the NBN cost excluding the new power stations required
These advocates of electric vehicles only by 2040 are completely bonkers. It takes 5-8 years to design and build a large coal fired power station like Loy Yang and even longer for a Nuclear one (That’s after you get the political will, permits and legislative changes needed ). Wind and solar just can’t produce enough. Tidal power might but that’s further away than nuclear.
It's just a greenies dream in the foreseeable future other than in small wealthy countries. It will no doubt ultimately come but not in the next 20 years...
The grid cannot support it in most places in Australia!
 

Haakon

Call me Ken, whoreken
The first bit was interesting, doesn’t surprise me Australian building standards are shit in this regard as well as the rest of it…

As for then launching into essentially unrelated and unsubstantiated musings on cost and viability of generation undid whatever credibility I was attributing to them….
 

goobags

Likes Dirt
Yeah that needs a whole heap of fact checking and sounds like someone who is educated enough to understand but doesn’t want to.

However off my very rough numbers, Australia would add at least 10% to its electricity consumption based on all passenger vehicles being electric right now.

Only numbers I could find are 180 billion kilometres per year from 2018 and 265 terawatt hours of electricity generated in 2020. based off 150Wh per kilometre which my Model 3 does but everything else pretty much does more than that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Haakon

Call me Ken, whoreken
Thing is you don’t. The system is built to handle peal demand (around 6pm as everyone gets home and turns everything on) but you charge overnight in the wee hours when demand is otherwise low. EVs just even out the demand curves.

The complication though is that peak generation in a renewable grid is the middle of the day when solar is cranking , so still need plenty of night (wind) generation.
 

goobags

Likes Dirt
Energy has to come from somewhere. I’m not saying we need more generators, however those generators will need to produce more energy.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

andrew9

Likes Dirt
I might be totally wrong, but I had the understanding that many people's transport needs could be met by a slower overnight charge from a standard 10a outlet
In metro apartments I would think the average km's to be quite low, and maybe a few bigger chargers could be available for when people have longer trips, maybe using a booking system?
If the buildings infrastructure can't handle an extra 10a outlet per apartment, then it was probably only a matter of time before they ran out of supply
 

silentbutdeadly

Eats Squid
Seen this, don't know the origin or the facts to back it up as it Vic.

----------------------------------------

Charging Electric Cars MELBOURNE
We recently did some work for the body corporate at the Dock 5 Apartment Building in Docklands in Melbourne to see if we could install a small number of electric charging points for owners to charge their electric vehicles. We had our first three applications. We discovered:
  1. Our building has no non- allocated parking spaces ie public ones. This is typical of most apartment buildings so we cannot provide shared outlets.
  2. The power supply in the building was designed for the loads in the building with virtually no spare capacity. Only 5 or 6 chargers could be installed in total in a building with 188 apartments!!
  3. How do you allocate them as they would add value to any apartment owning one. The shit fight started on day one with about 20 applications received 1st day and many more following.
  4. The car park sub-boards cannot carry the extra loads of even one charger and would have to be upgraded on any floors with a charger as would the supply mains to each sub board.
  5. The main switch board would then have to be upgraded to add the heavier circuit breakers for the sub mains upgrade and furthermore:
  6. When Docklands was designed a limit was put on the number of apartments in each precinct and the mains and transformers in the streets designed accordingly. This means there is no capacity in the Docklands street grid for any significant quantity of car chargers in any building in the area.
  7. It gets better. The whole CBD (Hoddle Grid, Docklands)and Southbank is fed by two sub stations. One in Port Melbourne and one in West Melbourne. This was done to have two alternate feeds in case one failed or was down for maintenance. Because of the growth in the city /Docklands and Southbank now neither one is now capable of supplying the full requirement of Melbourne zone at peak usage in mid- summer if the other is out of action. The Port Melbourne 66,000 volt feeder runs on 50 or 60 year old wooden power poles above ground along Dorcas Street South Melbourne. One is pole is located 40 cm from the corner Kerb at the incredibly busy Ferrars /St Dorcas St Intersection and is very vulnerable to being wiped out by a wayward vehicle.
  8. The infrastructure expenditure required would dwarf the NBN cost excluding the new power stations required
These advocates of electric vehicles only by 2040 are completely bonkers. It takes 5-8 years to design and build a large coal fired power station like Loy Yang and even longer for a Nuclear one (That’s after you get the political will, permits and legislative changes needed ). Wind and solar just can’t produce enough. Tidal power might but that’s further away than nuclear.
It's just a greenies dream in the foreseeable future other than in small wealthy countries. It will no doubt ultimately come but not in the next 20 years...
The grid cannot support it in most places in Australia!
I can't speak for some of the many inadequacies of Melbourne but most of that smells like bullshit. There is no doubt that most apartment buildings can't manage to retrofit vehicle charging stations but that's mostly about how much it'd cost apartment owners to physically modify their buildings to get power to cars. As for the rest...garbage.
 

downunderdallas

Likes Dirt
Seen this, don't know the origin or the facts to back it up as it Vic.

----------------------------------------

Charging Electric Cars MELBOURNE
We recently did some work for the body corporate at the Dock 5 Apartment Building in Docklands in Melbourne to see if we could install a small number of electric charging points for owners to charge their electric vehicles. We had our first three applications. We discovered:
  1. Our building has no non- allocated parking spaces ie public ones. This is typical of most apartment buildings so we cannot provide shared outlets.
  2. The power supply in the building was designed for the loads in the building with virtually no spare capacity. Only 5 or 6 chargers could be installed in total in a building with 188 apartments!!
  3. How do you allocate them as they would add value to any apartment owning one. The shit fight started on day one with about 20 applications received 1st day and many more following.
  4. The car park sub-boards cannot carry the extra loads of even one charger and would have to be upgraded on any floors with a charger as would the supply mains to each sub board.
  5. The main switch board would then have to be upgraded to add the heavier circuit breakers for the sub mains upgrade and furthermore:
  6. When Docklands was designed a limit was put on the number of apartments in each precinct and the mains and transformers in the streets designed accordingly. This means there is no capacity in the Docklands street grid for any significant quantity of car chargers in any building in the area.
  7. It gets better. The whole CBD (Hoddle Grid, Docklands)and Southbank is fed by two sub stations. One in Port Melbourne and one in West Melbourne. This was done to have two alternate feeds in case one failed or was down for maintenance. Because of the growth in the city /Docklands and Southbank now neither one is now capable of supplying the full requirement of Melbourne zone at peak usage in mid- summer if the other is out of action. The Port Melbourne 66,000 volt feeder runs on 50 or 60 year old wooden power poles above ground along Dorcas Street South Melbourne. One is pole is located 40 cm from the corner Kerb at the incredibly busy Ferrars /St Dorcas St Intersection and is very vulnerable to being wiped out by a wayward vehicle.
  8. The infrastructure expenditure required would dwarf the NBN cost excluding the new power stations required
These advocates of electric vehicles only by 2040 are completely bonkers. It takes 5-8 years to design and build a large coal fired power station like Loy Yang and even longer for a Nuclear one (That’s after you get the political will, permits and legislative changes needed ). Wind and solar just can’t produce enough. Tidal power might but that’s further away than nuclear.
It's just a greenies dream in the foreseeable future other than in small wealthy countries. It will no doubt ultimately come but not in the next 20 years...
The grid cannot support it in most places in Australia!
  1. Sure nothing especially unusual there
  2. Again why oversize the power supply although all depends on what chargers you are talking about be very surprised if a decent number of load managed 7kw chargers couldn't be installed.
  3. This is a problem for existing complexes
4./5.Again depends on charger and the board but dedicated boards and submains for EV chargers are what we put into new buildings not uncommon for this to cost up to $500K for the size complex in question, depending on the number and distribution of chargers.
6 Be very surprised if building doesn't have it's own transformer see point 2. rest of this sounds like rubbish.
7.Sounds dubious but in any case what has this got to do with anything?
8.Sounds like absolute rubbish unless they mean NBN cost per apartment in which case they are 100% right it's a lot more infrastructure than pulling through some fibre optic.

Last paragraph is just nonsense as some have already pointed out.
 

Lazmo

Old and hopeless
Pardon my ignorance, but I know eff all about electric cars. A few questions.

Going into the car, what is the voltage and current of a slow charging station?

Going into the car, what is the voltage and current of a fast charging station?

Are the chargers smart enough to know what’s plugged into them, and tweak the VI accordingly?
 

downunderdallas

Likes Dirt
Pardon my ignorance, but I know eff all about electric cars. A few questions.

Going into the car, what is the voltage and current of a slow charging station?

Going into the car, what is the voltage and current of a fast charging station?

Are the chargers smart enough to know what’s plugged into them, and tweak the VI accordingly?
I think most cars slowest charge is about 8A on a std 10A 240V outlet. Some loss along the way
"fast charging" varies from 125A @ 400V to 500A @ 800V but few cars can manage the later and even then not for long

and yes the chargers do know what is plugged in (some smarter than others and the car asks for what it is set to up to it's capacity at least that's how it seems like it works to me!
 

Lazmo

Old and hopeless
Thanks… for the slow charge is it 240v or bumped up? As in, going into the car.
 
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