Do you miss the flickability and fun of FS 26ers

Big JD

Wheel size expert
Look the whole 26er vs 29er, pros and cons has been done to death but I wonder if I have been missing out on something since moving exclusively to 29ers.
As a big guy (6.5) 29ers were a given but bigger frame / wheels / forks require additional strength = more weight/length. The 29ers ive owned have not been as flickable/manouvreable/ easy to manual as the 26ers of years ago. Over the last few years there is a growing trend to design 29ers with shorter chain stays and more relaxed angles. Certainly a shorter chainstay improves a 29ers ability to manual/flick and shortens the wheelbase - you can only go so far before you have front end climbing issues and weight distrubution concerns and this is often negated by relaxing the head angle (lengthens the wheelbase). This often improves the feel for more technical riding but many manufacturers are also shortening the top tubes - to encourage a more upright riding position. Example- an XL Yeti 575 or SB66 has an ETT of 25.8 inches yet their FS 29er is just 25. Shorten top tubes is probably another thread only relevent to us giants.
I used to ride with more aggression/flair/fun/flickability on 26ers. Is it just me - I am just getting old? For HTs- 29ers are a given - especially at my size but for FS I wonder if 26er dont make a better allrounder/trail bike (excude XC race). I know I rode 26er FS for over 15 years and loved it - 29er FS are just a different feel with different strengths.
Not looking to start any arguements here rather would like your thoughts/feelings. Especially from those that perhaps have a 26er FS and a 29er. I am aware of the marketting hype - wonder if we have got lost in it to some extent - just like we were told that we all needed to have 6 inches of travel for an allrounder yet for the majority of us - the trails/manner we ride dont require any. Many will tell me that their 4 -5 inch 29er FS is very capable, and I know that they are but has it changed the way you ride? When you are talking XXL FS 29ers (like I need) then a XL 26er with same size top tube is definately more agile/flickable/finese. Maybe it is because my bikes are so bloody big. Have 29ers sanitised some of the fun as now we roll over everything in our path with our big 29er wheels.
End woffle now.
Cheers
John

In a nutshell-
a discussion as to whether FS 29ers have changed/sanitised the way you ride or the MTBing experience
 
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Big JD

Wheel size expert
bet you once had a good flick mate

Isn't flicking what we used to be able to do with our hair?
yes Sumgy - a good flick could get you laid once apon a time (Nov 1987 to be exact) - now it will get you beaten up.

flickible is a poor choice of terms to describle an agile, fluid, expressive manner of riding but I thought I would loose too many if I used the term Mojo or soul biking.
 

Trigger02

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Can you pull tricks and jumps on your 29er as if it was a 26er????, My 29er cannot do much in terms of bunny hoping and is a little hard to manual which is what enjoy doing... Maybe i a have a crap Geo for this style of riding..
 

c3024446

Likes Bikes and Dirt
I don't know if we need ANOTHER 29er v 26er thread. I'm not sure why one hasn't been stickied yet.

I get disappointed when i come to this forum, and instead of seeing a review for a new bike, or pictures of one blinged up and weight weenied, i see another comparison between apples and oranges.
 

Trigger02

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Rotary vs V8, FS 26er being the rotor, a worked rotor always beats a V8 off the start (given certain standards)
 

Big JD

Wheel size expert
I was looking to discuss the ride rather than pros or cons

I don't know if we need ANOTHER 29er v 26er thread. I'm not sure why one hasn't been stickied yet.

I get disappointed when i come to this forum, and instead of seeing a review for a new bike, or pictures of one blinged up and weight weenied, i see another comparison between apples and oranges.
Never intended a 26er vs 29er thread rather a discussion as to whether a 29er fs has changed/sanitised the way you ride or the MTBing experience. It is comparative because I am talking about the ride experience rather than pros and cons of each size. There is alot of 29er bling on the web but little discussion about the feeling riding gives you - whether it is real/subjective or percieved - it might not have any revelance to others and I may not have conveyed the point I wanted to discuss - if so please move on, nothing to see here.
 
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Refreshinglygood

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Never intended a 26er vs 29er thread rather a discussion as to whether a 29er fs has changed/sanitised the way you ride or the MTBing experience. It is comparative because I am talking about the ride experience rather than pros and cons of each size. There is alot of 29er bling on the web but little discussion about the feeling riding gives you - whether it is real/subjective or percieved - it might not have any revelance to others and I may not have conveyed the point I wanted to discuss - if so please move on, nothing to see here.
no, not really. My choice in frames has been pushed towards the hyper short chainstay. they tend to be pretty flickable and hoppy. they have changed my riding, it's more about the lines that i choose than the "way" i ride.
 

nikmcc

Likes Dirt
I don't know if we need ANOTHER 29er v 26er thread. I'm not sure why one hasn't been stickied yet.

I get disappointed when i come to this forum, and instead of seeing a review for a new bike, or pictures of one blinged up and weight weenied, i see another comparison between apples and oranges.
I think this is a great thread idea.
Im thinking of making the switch (Transition Bandit 29) so I'll be keeping an eye on this thread for sure.

From what I've read and heard from other Bandit 29 owners, the Bandit still rides like a 26er... Yet to experience it for myself, but hopefully one day soon.
 

Big JD

Wheel size expert
the experience has changed

no, not really. My choice in frames has been pushed towards the hyper short chainstay. they tend to be pretty flickable and hoppy. they have changed my riding, it's more about the lines that i choose than the "way" i ride.
Hi RG

I have been on 29ers for the last 6 years and it is really only recently that the shorter chainstays are readily available (few boutique brands only). One of the biggest issues many had with the first batch of FS 29ers was the fact that they were harder to manouvour (spelling) and felt like boats. We are now spoilt for choice with many brands like Devinci, lenz and transition all doing 29er FS trail bikes with short stays. I really need to ride some of the new short stay FS 29ers - try finding one that fits to test ride.
You say 29ers have change the way you ride and that you are now more (or less) conscious of the lines you choose - I agree with you - it has changed the way i ride too and it is not all for the good (or I am not getting the same thrill / experience - it has changed somewhat).
cheers
JD
 

Sumgy

Likes Bikes and Dirt
I have not lost this ability on my 29er.
I never had it on my 26er. :distrust:
 

Big JD

Wheel size expert
I think this is a great thread idea.
Im thinking of making the switch (Transition Bandit 29) so I'll be keeping an eye on this thread for sure.

From what I've read and heard from other Bandit 29 owners, the Bandit still rides like a 26er... Yet to experience it for myself, but hopefully one day soon.
hey Nik, what is it about riding a 26er that the Transition Bandit is trying to capture - is that what I am trying to discuss - is that what i have have missing? Or as Mr Paul Van Der Ploeg discusses here.

http://www.paulvanderploeg.com/2012/...6-29-650b.html

Has there also been a massive shift away from the classic XC setup/ergomomics to a more upright riding position or is that the 29er thing (riding in the bike rather than on the bike).

Sorry that is like 5 questions
 

ViS

Likes Dirt
I have a custom titanium hardtail 29er with a 69 degree HA, chainstays as short as physically possible, a 70mm stem and a 120mm fork.

I also have a 26" Pivot Mach 5 with 150mm fork and an s-works fsr stumpy 120mm 26er. My 29er is as nimble and as flickable as both my other bikes.

I think as long as you research what you want out of the 29er, you can have a big wheeler that will still be a hell of a lot of fun on the trails.

I'm a big fan of the Banshee Paradox. I think it has the geometry dialled in perfectly. I based my titanium HT loosely on the paradox, with several tweaks to suit what I wanted out of the bike.
 
I crash less riding 29ers (busted skewers excepted) so I suppose my riding has been sanitized a bit...but really Im quite pleased with this.

Just wait a couple more weeks John and I'll have the new wheels on the Lenz and you can ride that. Its a huge amount more responsive and faster steering than my Ells evolve was, its might not be quite as gumby proof. I did like the way you could just crash into stuff with the Evolve and it was barely deflected, but the only time I was riding like that was at the end of 100km races when I was properly rooted and would almost have been happy to crash just to get a little lie down.

I don't get the people I see out riding on 6 inch travel bikes at places like Lysterfield or Wombat...there just isn't anything there you need anything like 6 inches, in fact I dont even think I need 4 inches out there. Allowing for the fact that people go significantly faster than me, then perhaps some of them might get the maximium out of my 4 inches, then thats fine but I cant see why on earth you need the massive compromises in climbing that 6 inches gives you when there just isnt any advantage to it. I'll suggest that it is merely a fashion and image thing...I mean the slack angle long travel bikes sure do look really fast, strangely though the guys who go past me are generally skinny dudes on hardtails.
My kingdom for a better engine.
 

gbear

Likes Bikes
I recently got back into the sport after a 10 year break due to spinal injury.

I rode 16 " 20" 24" 26" since i could walk, BMX, even 16" pit bikes , BMX cruisers then 26 MTB / DH and most recently XC.

I bought the 29er as Im a big guy 6FT3 115KG, and chose an Anthem X1. I enjoyed it definately, did a few 6 hours and a 12 hours. But i honestly felt something missing, and its exactly what the OP was referring too. Throwing the bike a bit, flairing out the rear here and there.

On a whim/gut instinct whatever i decided to just sell the anthem as it was only a month old in excellent condition, and got almost what I paid for it back, so it was no loss to see if A) i could actually ride again and B) wether it was fun.

Yes on both counts. Long story short i wanted a 26" , so i ended up getting a second hand Santa Cruz Nickel off a member here ( thanks Ben! ) and I am amazed just how different the bikes are, I definately enjoy the 26" as I can throw it much more than the anthem, and it just feels like a more fun bike to ride.

29er use? Well sure, I will be buying another one for longer enduros for comfort, rolling speed and sheer laziness on my part, but for day to day squirts at my local trails, the 26" trumps every time. thats just me, everyone is different.

Just because I rode 1 29er and didnt like its lack of playfullness, doesnt mean they all ride the same and that 29ers suck, which is what i read quite often.

For me its just about the fun, and the fact I can even ride a bike again after 10 years is a miracle for me, so i just choose the size wheels that suit my given purpose, and no matter what im riding, im always smiling :)
 

Big JD

Wheel size expert
good story bear

Why would a XL Yeti SB 66 have a top tube of 25.8 and an XL SB95 have a top tube of just 24.9. I would have thought the need to have a shorter top tube on the 26er with 6 inches of travel rather than the 29er with 5 inches. Example - I personally could run a 80mm stem with wide bars on a 25.8 TT but would need a 120mm for the 24.9 29er. Do you really ride 29ers so differently?
IGNORE that question - another thread.
 
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I think I know what it might be John.

Wheelbase. Longer is more stable and less 80's hair flickable.

So, in order to keep the zing in a 5 inch 29er...which obviously is going to need longer forks than a 3 inch 29er something has to give and its either head angle or top tube, now knocking the head angle back a degree or two and making it steeper has a tonne of issues when you are making something thats obviously focused on rough stuff.

Its much easier on a 26 in bike because you can have chainstays 1.5 inches shorter and toe overlap is something they think is a surfing term.

Silly question but why do you need a reach of 735.32mm on a 26er and 752.46mm in a 29er?...(25.8in plus 80mm and 24.9in plus 120mm) I reckon its much closer to being the same if you run a 100mm stem on the 29er...like 3mm different.
 

OCD'R

Likes Dirt
Hi John,
I'm 6'5.5" so share/understand where you are coming from.
I rode a 26 HT for ten plus years, then transitioned to CX and now have that big black Yeti '95 (to accompany the CX). I remember being more BMXish on the 26", definitely easier to maneuver etc. The CX has been the most rewarding riding I have ever done I think, the concentration and forethought required to keep decent and fluid pace is both mentally tiring (in a good way) and smile inducing. The 29er on the other hand is almost the opposite of the CX. I can bomb anything, up or down, XC, just power down and ride. It isn't technical, or I'm not yet riding it the way i should be. I've only had it a couple of weeks, though at this stage it isn't mentally stimulating me. I'm sure as time goes by I'll play to its strengths but I'm missing the technical side of riding... The brain work. It is laugh inducing good though, don't get me wrong, it is just a different experience.

I'm thinking I need a 29er HT to complete my off road garage and at my height it will be 29er all the way, no doubt. Finally, I look normal on a bike. Sorry for the slight tangent... If any of that makes sense.
 
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