Electric Vehicles etc

[shiny]

New GWM Ora Looks like a Fiat 500 and a Porsche had a baby and $46k

https://www.gwmhaval.com.au/ora

 

[indica]

$46k

Good for town, 310km range would not work for me.

 

[Asininedrivel]

Exactly. For Tesla money I’d be wanting cutting edge batteries, excellent packaging and high end chassis component manufacturing and design.

Not an old Mac strut setup with pressed steel parts…

Parentals have a Polestar 2. Were keen on a Model 3 but Tesla gave approx. zero fucks with customer service and never returned their calls / emails.

Sometimes you just go with the company that actually seems to give a shit about its customers, rather than one with a CEO that thinks continuously insulting his core customer demographic on Twitter is cool.

 

[Haakon]

Parentals have a Polestar 2. Were keen on a Model 3 but Tesla gave approx. zero fucks with customer service and never returned their calls / emails.

Sometimes you just go with the company that actually seems to give a shit about its customers, rather than one with a CEO that thinks continuously insulting his core customer demographic on Twitter is cool.

That wouldn't sway me either way. No car company gives a shit about you once they have your money.

I think that sounds like your parents tried to treat Tesla like a car dealer and wanted to be wooed - that was never going to happen! I prefer the cold approach of Tesla, its more honest.

 

[Haakon]

Polestar 2 is a fine car, very nice by most metrics. Its just not as good as a Tesla, and if they want to charge Tesla money for it then its a bit of a non starter in my book. If it was 15-20K cheaper, I'd be lauding it as a fine option.

 

[Oddjob]

Polestar 2 is a fine car, very nice by most metrics. Its just not as good as a Tesla, and if they want to charge Tesla money for it then its a bit of a non starter in my book. If it was 15-20K cheaper, I'd be lauding it as a fine option.

Depends on whether you care about things like, build and ride quality...

Sent from my M2012K11AG using Tapatalk

 

[Haakon]

Depends on whether you care about things like, build and ride quality...

Sent from my M2012K11AG using Tapatalk

I haven’t driven a polestar. @Scotty T what’s the ride like on the polestar vs the model 3? And is it noticeably better for those all important panel gaps?

 

[Scotty T]

I haven’t driven a polestar. @Scotty T what’s the ride like on the polestar vs the model 3? And is it noticeably better for those all important panel gaps?

Very similar drive in most aspects, Polestar had a slight bit more body roll which you'd expect from a taller car. With two big blokes sitting on the left + driver it would torque steer to the left, but only if you really smashed it from low speed. Having not driven the dual motor Tesla I don't know if it does this. Both feel incredibly planted, and both do the battery weight lurch when you go through a bump on a corner at speed. Very similar in the steering too.

The one pedal driving is not as touchy in the Polestar, but a couple of times I wasn't sure it would pull up at a T intersection so touched the brake probably uneccesarily. My mate who has driven both said it was a great car but not as refined as the Tesla and I'd agree with that.

The Polestar's tight cabin makes it harder to drive, visibility is less, I love the feeling of the spacious cabin in the Tesla, the visbility is unrivalled and if you're a small person the Polestar has a very high dash.

On the panel gaps (that don't exist anymore) I'll put in the words of one of my team who has a Model Y on order: "who cares". Neither Tesla I have hired had panel gap issues or problems with ride quality, that was the first series 3 and a 2022 3.

 

[Oddjob]

On the panel gaps (that don't exist anymore) I'll put in the words of one of my team who has a Model Y on order: "who cares". Neither Tesla I have hired had panel gap issues or problems with ride quality, that was the first series 3 and a 2022 3.

The panel gaps are an indication of overall build qaulity. If the panel gaps are out, chances are there are problems with sqeuaky interiors, loose stitching, wiring harnesses aren't connected properly, loose bolts, and out of spec bushings etc etc.

This is why Fiat Chrysler and French cars cop a hammering on the secondary market. Whereas a well maintained Porsche, Mercedes, Golf or Toyota will seemingly go forever and secondary values reflect that.

BMW and Land Rover are their own weird categories. Some of them are piles of shit from day 1, others go on forever.

Apparently BYD are getting input from their investors Toyota, so that's part of the reason we went with an Atto 3 over a poverty spec model 3.



Sent from my M2012K11AG using Tapatalk

 

[indica]

an Atto 3

I'm warming to the idea.
What do you do for charging? Do you have a flash charger at home?

 

[Haakon]

The panel gaps are an indication of overall build qaulity. If the panel gaps are out, chances are there are problems with sqeuaky interiors, loose stitching, wiring harnesses aren't connected properly, loose bolts, and out of spec bushings etc etc.

I don't buy that - the manufacturing processes for panel gaps are completely different to trim etc. Its just a very visible one people get hung up on, and I get it - if id dropped a significant sum on a new toy and the obvious bits were wonky id be a little sad.

But I dont think its a meaningful metric when looking at the overall quality of the product.

 

[Tubbsy]

I can’t stand shitty fit and finish on cars, or anything really. What’s the excuse? It just says anssembly is rushed to me, and when these things are being put together by robots you have to wonder. Makes me suspect corners are being cut elsewhere.

I can certainly appreciate the fact that Tesla are miles ahead with the tech, but pretty sure whatever EV we end up with will be a second or third gen from a legacy car maker once their pure-EV platforms are established.

 

[Haakon]

I can’t stand shitty fit and finish on cars, or anything really. What’s the excuse? It just says anssembly is rushed to me, and when these things are being assembled by robots you have to wonder. Makes me suspect corners are being cut elsewhere.

I can certainly appreciate the fact that Tesla are miles ahead with the tech, but pretty sure whatever EV we end up with will be a second or third gen from a legacy car maker once their pure-EV platforms are established.

No corner cutting, in the case of Tesla it was just learning to refine the machine that makes the machine. They have that sorted now, but it wasnt a massive priority ahead of the parts of the car that really count - and in that they are ahead and will remain ahead of legacy makers.

Lots of people may feel more comfortable with a legacy brand for whatever reason, but really cant see Tesla not being the sensible choice if efficiency and function are what you seek.

 

[indica]

efficiency and function are what you seek.

What's efficiency mean in terms of an EV?

Tesla Model 3 $68,000 and 491 km
Cupra Born $63,490 and 511 km
Kona Electric Extended Range $64,000 and 480 km serviced at Hyundai
BYD Atto 3 $51,000 and 480 km serviced at Kmart

Nothing in that suggests a Tesla is a good idea for me.

 

[Haakon]

What's efficiency mean in terms of an EV?

Tesla Model 3 $68,000 and 491 km
Cupra Born $63,490 and 511 km
Kona Electric Extended Range $64,000 and 480 km serviced at Hyundai
BYD Atto 3 $51,000 and 480 km serviced at Kmart

Nothing in that suggests a Tesla is a good idea for me.

it means the distance travelled per unit of energy. same as for a petrol car...

It also means performance for the size of the battery/weight of the car.

 

[indica]

It also means performance for the size of the battery/weight of the car.

Okay - I cannot see on the Tesla site the battery size.

 

[Oddjob]

I'm warming to the idea.
What do you do for charging? Do you have a flash charger at home?

A standard wall plug. We only do small trips most of the time.

Sent from my M2012K11AG using Tapatalk

 

[Tubbsy]

if efficiency and function are what you seek.

Well ideally I’d have that, plus something that is well made, looks good and drives well too. I’ve seen some (possibly clickbaity) things about even recent top Plaid models being built like shit.

If I could justify a Taycan… Anyway, big respect to Tesla for genuinely disrupting a colossal industry though.

Anyway, I haven’t driven any electric car yet, so file this under ‘banter’ until I have.

 

[Oddjob]

No corner cutting, in the case of Tesla it was just learning to refine the machine that makes the machine. They have that sorted now, but it wasnt a massive priority ahead of the parts of the car that really count - and in that they are ahead and will remain ahead of legacy makers.

Lots of people may feel more comfortable with a legacy brand for whatever reason, but really cant see Tesla not being the sensible choice if efficiency and function are what you seek.

I disagree. Given that battery technology is improving so quickly the priority should be a car that will last and be able to have it's battery replaced in the future. Eg Nissan Leafs getting new blade battery packs. If the car is made like shit and it's looking pretty tired at 7 years, then a battery replacement is essentially a write off.

Even then on the technology side, BYD has better batteries, VAG (which includes Porsche and Rimac) and Ford have better motors; and Waymo will win on self driving cars.

Despite Toyotas late start and the VW ID range being a pile of shit, I would put my money on Toyota and VAG long term.

Sent from my M2012K11AG using Tapatalk

 

[Dales Cannon]

Well ideally I’d have that, plus something that is well made, looks good and drives well too. I’ve seen some (possibly clickbaity) things about even recent top Plaid models being built like shit.

If I could justify a Taycan… Anyway, big respect to Tesla for genuinely disrupting a colossal industry though.

Anyway, I haven’t driven any electric car yet, so file this under ‘banter’ until I have.

These are available in your size.