Russia Vs. America; Here we go again kids!

Oddjob

Merry fucking Xmas to you assholes
And we all thought that the risk of conflagration was westward....

By this time next year, the Ukrainians will be at the gates of Moscow.
If they could negotiate to get the Russian's out of the Donbas and Crimea that would be a crushing victory. Zelensky needs to start dressing like a Mujahideen.

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cokeonspecialtwodollars

Fartes of Portingale
Isn't Belgorod on the Russian side of the border? Is that a POW photo?

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Reports are that two Ukrainian helicopters attacked a Russian fuel depot in Belgorod although Ukraine hasn't claimed responsibility for the attack... the photo in the screenshot johnny put up is a meme.
 

johnny

I'll tells ya!
Staff member
Reports are that two Ukrainian helicopters attacked a Russian fuel depot in Belgorod although Ukraine hasn't claimed responsibility for the attack... the photo in the screenshot johnny put up is a meme.
Have you seen the footage of the attack? Caught on a number of different cameras. OF course, with Uktaine also using Hinds, it's hard to tell who it actually was. My money is on the Ukrainians. I do find it funny that the Russians are protesting the act, like they're an innocent party that has been horribly wronged.
 

cokeonspecialtwodollars

Fartes of Portingale
Have you seen the footage of the attack? Caught on a number of different cameras. OF course, with Uktaine also using Hinds, it's hard to tell who it actually was. My money is on the Ukrainians. I do find it funny that the Russians are protesting the act, like they're an innocent party that has been horribly wronged.
One has to question why there is any footage at all if it was such a surprise attack, I'd imagine that the Ukrainian pilots are very adept at flying below the radar and wouldn't blame them for retaliating against the Russians however it is still plausible that it was a staged Russian attack on their own infrastructure so they can escalate their current operations.
 

rockmoose

his flabber is totally gastered
Or a Russian attack from military personnel that don't want to be there, and see it as a way of stymieing their forward thrust?
 

wornoutwords

Likes Dirt
The resistance and russian failure has been amazing to watch.
The weapon support provided (and I'm sure a lot of it is to beta test your weapons against someone that's a higher tier than peasant farmers) + the baltic and bordering scandinavian countries probably consider it a war for their survival too so they've taken it very seriously

It's like the annoying jerk that has been wrecking your shit for years, but each instance wasn't enough to sperg out over has finally gone too far. And you realise you've all been thinking the same thing. And everyone's piling on.

The ransomware attacks
The poisonings and assassinations in western countries
And most importantly imho - the sewing discord through poisoning grass root movements that are fundamentally good
- medical science and politicians coming together to tackle a new global disease - fundamentally good
- addressing violence against women - fundamentally good
- lgbt rights -fundamentally good
- cops not shooting people because of the colour of the skin - fundamentally good
- not wrecking the planet, and 'sustainability' might mean having to tone it back a bit if the current rate is not sustainable - fundamentally good

It's a lot easier to wreck something good than it is to create something from scratch. I've seen some of my more mental midget rellies (not the euro/polish side ofc) try the 'russia is just protecting themselves from nato' crap and whataboutism at the start, but then it's like they snapped out of a fugue as they realised what they were saying. And it's made their other anti vax/lgbt crap more half assed because they've lost some of their conviction and the professional amplification isn't there anymore (it's moved over to pushing the russia is just defending itself/the poor conscripts/the west will freeze and run out of petrol narratives - which aren't sticking)
 

johnny

I'll tells ya!
Staff member
One has to question why there is any footage at all if it was such a surprise attack, I'd imagine that the Ukrainian pilots are very adept at flying below the radar and wouldn't blame them for retaliating against the Russians however it is still plausible that it was a staged Russian attack on their own infrastructure so they can escalate their current operations.
Play that idea, that it's a Russian false flag out. How could they escalate their operations in Ukraine?
 

Litenbror

Eats Squid
Play that idea, that it's a Russian false flag out. How could they escalate their operations in Ukraine?
Not saying it is but it could galvanize support for the operation at home, the propaganda machine needs fuel.

I think it was CCTV or security footage from what I read but thats no fun for conspiracy theories.

The real story for me is how quickly attitudes can change about countries/leaders and things can get done with the western media behind them. It's quite the formidable weapon that we are seeing in action.
 

cokeonspecialtwodollars

Fartes of Portingale
Play that idea, that it's a Russian false flag out. How could they escalate their operations in Ukraine?
Not saying it is but it could galvanize support for the operation at home, the propaganda machine needs fuel.
This was my train of thought, Russia gets to point a finger and say see we told you Ukraine isn't peaceful now we can withdraw from negotiations and use this as justification.
 

Oddjob

Merry fucking Xmas to you assholes
This was my train of thought, Russia gets to point a finger and say see we told you Ukraine isn't peaceful now we can withdraw from negotiations and use this as justification.
But to what end? Russia is bleeding blood and treasure hand over fist. If Ukraine becomes a bleeding ulcer for them, what does Russia gain?

The best thing that can happen for Putin now is the Russian army to leave Ukraine in one piece without mass desertions and the conscript system breaking down, Ukraine to remain nuetral, and for the west to lift sanctions. There is no good that can come from Russia drawing out the conflict. They have no hope of conquering and holding any major cities and it's unlikely that the economic pain will stop until they reach a stable peace. This may include Ukraine dictating that Russia leave the Donbas and Crimea.

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johnny

I'll tells ya!
Staff member
This was my train of thought, Russia gets to point a finger and say see we told you Ukraine isn't peaceful now we can withdraw from negotiations and use this as justification.
If they were going to do a false flag to galvanise their citizens, they'd attack something far less important to their military than a huge amount of fuel. They'd attack something more important to the population like a symbolic target or the population itself.

But let's say they did use this to galvanise support from the population, what then? Are they going to try and take over the capital and install their own government? Are they going to start indiscriminately shelling cities and killing everyone? Are they going to start executing civilians in the street? Are they going to threaten the world with nuclear war?

They're already doing all of these things and they've failed to achieve their goals. The Russians are getting their arses handed to them - the LAST thing the Kremlin needs is a supercharged population demanding revenge which Putin can't deliver. There's zero chance that this was false flag, the target alone would suggest that, the strategic environment confirms it, IMO.
 

cokeonspecialtwodollars

Fartes of Portingale
But to what end? Russia is bleeding blood and treasure hand over fist. If Ukraine becomes a bleeding ulcer for them, what does Russia gain?

The best thing that can happen for Putin now is the Russian army to leave Ukraine in one piece without mass desertions and the conscript system breaking down, Ukraine to remain nuetral, and for the west to lift sanctions. There is no good that can come from Russia drawing out the conflict. They have no hope of conquering and holding any major cities and it's unlikely that the economic pain will stop until they reach a stable peace. This may include Ukraine dictating that Russia leave the Donbas and Crimea.

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If they were going to do a false flag to galvanise their citizens, they'd attack something far less important to their military than a huge amount of fuel. They'd attack something more important to the population like a symbolic target or the population itself.

But let's say they did use this to galvanise support from the population, what then? Are they going to try and take over the capital and install their own government? Are they going to start indiscriminately shelling cities and killing everyone? Are they going to start executing civilians in the street? Are they going to threaten the world with nuclear war?

They're already doing all of these things and they've failed to achieve their goals. The Russians are getting their arses handed to them - the LAST thing the Kremlin needs is a supercharged population demanding revenge which Putin can't deliver. There's zero chance that this was false flag, the target alone would suggest that, the strategic environment confirms it, IMO.
Fair points, I'm definitely not a military strategist. Is there a reason why Ukraine would deny responsibility for the attack?
 
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